tech stronger than magic?

[mojoman777]

magic is stronger I think

[Mark]

I definitely think that magic is weaker, because of all the morphing.  when it goes into battle, it kills off all its former workforce.  Magic units kill each other with the splashes they have.

[modman]

That is a pretty good point.  The splashes bug really hurts Magic!

Is it really a bug?  I think so because you're supposed to be able to make the splash not hurt your own team in the XML.

[-Archmage-]

now otherwise magic would be to strong and it would kill to many enemie's before they could get through your lines
besides if you were standing next to a guy and someone through a grenade next to his feet, wouldn't you get hurt or possibly killed?

[John.d.h]

I agree.  All of Magic's splash effects seem to be basically big explosions.  That's going to hurt both friend and foe.  However, fixing the XML problem might still be worth doing.

[modman]

OK but the splash is most likely basically a spell anyways, so the grenade analogy doesn't apply.

Since it is a magical explosion, then, we can use the damage all value to modify the strength of Magic in a new way!

[-Archmage-]

hmm...sounds interesting

[Omega]

I STILL think its all in the player. What magic needs is the ability to generate energy from a single energy source, and for the initiate to match the worker (and maybe it would be best to run, rather than to make a fool of himself trying to fight).

No offense meant, but magic is for REAL gamers. I mean the people who clock hundreds of hours, who would max levels and do literally EVERYTHING in the game. THe true masters of the game. Magic is not for the faint hearted. You need SKILL and STRATEGY. Thats what makes magic different from the 'throw-everything-you-got' tech. If you can't use magic right, you simply aren't a good enough player. In my recent games, I have killed no more than 5 of my own units, and tech factions do worse than that (airships and catipults murder).

@Glest Master - You need experience of using units right (rather than just throwing as many strong ones as possible into battle) to win as magic.

@mojoman777 - Finally someone around here who is politically correct.

@Mark - The morphing can be used to your advantage, and once you get used to it, it seems pretty normal. And as I said before, once you get the experience, you'll find you won't kill very many of your own units (NEVER make daemons. Go for battlemages instead [no splash]).

@john.d.h - Agreed. Except remember that the battlemage, which is magics most commonly used unit, does not have a splash. (the battlemage should be your most used unit).

@modman - Are you trying to OVERPOWER magic? The splash EQUALIZES the factions attacks. It forces you to be more creative about using units like the archmage (same for their low HP).

[-Archmage-]

i usually don't play against magic because it never fights back
but when i do play magic and actually get into it, then i do agree that magic is very strong if you use it right

but i think the archmage is a bit weak in ep regenration
because guys he is an archmage and he uses magic i think he should have 60 ep regeneration speed instead of 30

[Omega]

Once again, I disagree. While you are right about the CPU sucking at magic, the archmage's EP is good. Otherwise, It would be too powerful, and sometimes I have only survived because the archmage had to pause to regen EP. This prevents it from continiously spamming spells.

[-Archmage-]

i know but it take way to long

[Omega]

Be creative....

[miniman36]

Wow, it's the complete opposite for me. When i use magic, i am in control of the situation the whole time. When I use tech, I am usually slaughtered very early against a com. Mainly because they can get an attack going before i even have any troops.

[Omega]

Nice to see another great magic fan then!

[-Archmage-]

i think tech can be easier to play with, but when the magic faction is used right or by the right person it's real powerful

[Omega]

Well said archmage101.

Tech is a beginner faction, magic is a advanced faction. Martino himself has said that, and he spent days balancing them.

Tech is good for most new players, but once you get the hang of magic, it is usually more powerful. Of course, with CPUs, magic is at a disadvantage...

[-Archmage-]

i consider my Dad the master of tech
he's not into magic and stuff and whenever i come up with a new faction he beats it with tech

but hehehe...
i copied tech renamed it empire and made it super strong and now my Dad has copied tech and renamed it lee-tech, and it's just slightly tweaked and he's going to keep tweaking it until he can beat empire

[Omega]

Forgive my rudeness here:

CHEATER!

[orion]

Magic and tech are indeed balanced. The only problem I've ever had is the fact that the cpu creates magic units way earlier than it does tech units. The result is tech usually getting destroyed in the beginning of the game.

Magic is the faction for me. I've held off 2 cpu ultras with the magic faction. If you're concerned with the fact that magic has the potential to kill your own units because of the splash radius then magic is not for you. You won't kill your own units if you choose the right combination of units to send to battle. For instance, if you send 10 behemoths and 10 archmages to battle then the behemoths will most likely not survive and it would be a waste seeing as how it takes some time to create a behemoth. If you, however, combined dragons with archmages, then that's a powerful strategy. Personally, I always have a group of archmages I like to call the "suicide squad". One time, the cpu ultra managed to gather 60+ units against me. You can't beat 60+ units with tech. However, if you're using magic, just create about 10 archmages and get them to use their flare attack (the one that costs 1000ep) all at once. People say the flare attack is bad because it costs so much EP and it KILLS. I say different; I love the flare attack because I could MURDER A LOT OF UNITS.

One more thing that magic has is a better experience system. Tech units only have 2 experience levels (normal and elite). Magic units, however, can unleash all sorts of hell. Have any of you ever seen a "legendary" archmage unit. IT'S A GOD. When used correctly, this one unit can destroy so much. Sometimes, when I really want a legendary archmage, I will summon a lot of daemons and slaughter them with the archmage. Another useful unit is the drake rider. At first they're not that good, but when they become "master" drake riders, they have so much defense and are useful in the battle field. Their very usefull for "hit and run" and scout tactics.

Forgive me for writing an essay, but I fully believe that tech is for beginners and magic is for the experts. Tech may give you a quick victory, but If you want BLOW THINGS UP, use magic. It's much easier to defeat the cpu ultra with magic than it is with tech. 

[njdnjd3]

NOTE: this is Archmage101 on my best friends account

omega
that's not cheating that's just trying to beat my Dad and my Dad trying to beat me 

i'll upload empire if you want

[glest master]

techially u would win a cpu normal not ultra magic team with just 12 armor swordman or guards.

[Omega]

Orion, well played. You are right on every emphasis. It really depends a lot on the strategy and player, which is why some may question the balance. Wait a second... Magic is overpowered. Maybe the topic should be named 'How to Improve Tech So That It Won't Be Killed By the Expert Magic Players Everytime'.

@Glest Master, this is because the CPU is pretty horrid, and even the CPU ultra isn't that good (just more resources, which let it get more units, nothing else to improve it over a normal CPU). Also, the CPU is not human (duh) so it cannot properly use magic (see Orion's post above for using magic).

@Archmage101, I dunno about you, but usually modifying units to make super units and having unlimited gold seems a lot like cheating to me... Glest is easy to modify, so cheating may not even seem like cheating. BTW, if you want to beat your dad, do it fairly (more fun, better feeling). Go back to square one with an UNMODIFIED version of tech for your dad and an unmodified version of magic for you. If you can learn magic, I'm confident you will beat him sooner or later (of course, the key point in here is 'learn magic', which may take some time to master). As Orion pointed out before, magic can wipe out HUGE numbers of units in one group with the archmages (see his note on the 'suicide group').

i'll upload empire if you want

It's  just a modified tech. What would we need that for ???

[-Archmage-]

i still wouldn't stand a chance even with two CPU-ultra's on my team

[glest master]

techially for the splash the archmage will make the most splash i think.

[-Archmage-]

yes static fire makes the biggest splash radius of 5