Walls?

[ZaggyDad]

Sorry to lead us even more astray, but, that seems a little personal that you know that...just kidding.

Haw haw haw.

[modman]

OK so to get this done there needs to be two new features.  The first is units that are not necessarily square, for example 1x3.  The second would probably be the ability of two units to merge together.  In this way, two adjascent wall units could join and become one.

There would be different types of wall parts.  Three basic types though:
1) A connecing part, it doesn't do anything special except link the other two together.
2) An attacking one that attacks like any other type.  Please note that this should be the only one that needs to be distroyed.  If distroyed, both the gates and the connecting pieces are too.  For example below the a's stand for attacking pieces, g's stand for gates, and numbers stand for connectors.

Code: [Select]

a12a34g56a78aIf the first attacker were distroyed, then connectors 1 and 2 would be as well.  But if the second attacker were distroyed, then numbers 1 through 6 and the gate would also be.
3) Gates would keep creeps out of your town, but would immediately allow any other unit through, whether it be enemy or friendly.

[Idanwin]

I disagree with destroying connectors.
I do like the only keep creeps out gate, I think it should be something like this:


Most creeps wouldn't enter a fortified village. Enemies would.

However the stone wall with a real gate should keep both creeps and enemies out.

~Idanwin

[ZaggyDad]

I disagree with destroying connectors.
I do like the only keep creeps out gate, I think it should be something like this:
[image]

Most creeps wouldn't enter a fortified village. Enemies would.

However the stone wall with a real gate should keep both creeps and enemies out.

~Idanwin

Definitely. It would defeat the purpose of gates if it didn't keep all enemies out until destroyed. But the gate you represented in the image wouldn't keep "creeps" out. It would be thoroughly useless. (But anyway, I don't even think there should be any creeps.) And the wall sections should all be destroyed as single units. Think about it this way: one swordsman is attacking one of the "attackers." He finally destroys the attacker. Then suddenly, as soon as it's dead, four of the other sections disappear. That's what it would be like. And where's the sense in that?!

[Idanwin]

Most wild boars don't attack fortified villages, it's a fact. (same with other animals)
Some packs of wild animals might, but most won't.

[modman]

I think the important part is teaching the CPU how to act, and also how to build the walls and gates so that it is effective, and of lesser importance, unpredictable.  At first, we could simply teach the CPU a simple, yet effective pattern that it could repeat.  Later there could be a possible complex algorythm on how and where to build them.

For starters, walls should never be built less than ten tiles from the castle-like building.

[mictes]

Or maybe you can define in the mapeditor possible positions for a wall, that would be technically the easiest and securest thing.

[modman]

...the easiest and securest thing

I don't think so.  There are billions of possible games for every map, so nope.  Plus people may want to build walls in totally different places, and that's not a problem since they have intellegence, yet an AI does not.

I don't want a discussion on intellegence here, so just read this.

[Idanwin]

The AI should calculate how much space it'll need for all it's buildings. Then it should build a wall all around that space (And stop at trees, stones and other obstacles. When a tree gets chopped down however they should build a wall there to make shure the enemy can't just walk in.
And a gate at every points were their units would cross to attack the other players.
And some tower around every gate.
When attacking however, they should better attack the parts with fewest towers/weakest walls.

~Idanwin

[verarticus]

The AI should calculate how much space it'll need for all it's buildings. Then it should build a wall all around that space (And stop at trees, stones and other obstacles. When a tree gets chopped down however they should build a wall there to make shure the enemy can't just walk in.
And a gate at every points were their units would cross to attack the other players.
And some tower around every gate.
When attacking however, they should better attack the parts with fewest towers/weakest walls.

~Idanwin

that would make it perfect...but this is the AI that walk into walls get caught on everything build building that trap themselves and then if out of gold just walk to the nearest gold source with random people not attacking (even if there are enemies there or its an enemy base etc.) so...who would like to code some super advance Lord of the Rings Battle for Middle Earth II    Smart AI?

[Idanwin]

I would,
if I could.
But I can't,
so I won't.
Not yet.

[modman]

How poetic.

I don't see this happening in Glest for quite a while.

[battle machine man]

How about adding walls?
A primary type of defense in most RTS

Like you can choose how wide its gonna be and it only cost stone and maybe putting archers on the walls so they can just shoot at the attacking enemy

no walls can be climbed so mapey this then ugrade 2 bunker tower ooh mages 2? ??? i mean in tower also maybe gates only buildable between trees or walls? I meant for mages and you call ME stupid bisurge?

[modman]

How intelligent.  How about some ideas on how the walls should work, and also so I can understand it!

[Omega]

Once again, poor english. Not meaning to sound rude, but I'm starting to dislike this Battle Machine Guy... Also this topic was very old.

Walls should be climbable, but since they are still not implemented, and are very far off in the future (if ever), it makes no real difference.

I don't see this happening in Glest for quite a while.

If ever...

[modman]

I concur.

[bisurge]

Erm, put archers on the wall?
Isn't that a... defense tower?
Anyways, I know I sometimes make walls out of energy sources with battlemages behind them just for fun. And on Tech, a huge chunk of defense tower never hurts.

[modman]

In Stronghold and Stronghold 2, you can build walls and then put archers and other military on them.  That's what we want!

[Darth_Mascurse]

I would concur with modman!

I know...I know...I'm totally new, but I'm still entitled to an opinion right?

I think that this game would definitely benefit from the addition of walls, but they need to be thought out REALLY well before they are added.

Although the idea of putting units on the walls appeals to me...I feel that the air units that Stronghold and Stronghold 2 don't have would make that ability useless as the air units can just hit them from above, but at the same time, it would be a good defense against ground units.

Is there a catapult unit available?  If so I haven't found it yet!

[modman]

Welcome Darth_Mascurse! (I love welcoming people that agree with me! )

Tech has a Catapult, just so you know.  If you build a Technodrome with the Worker and then make a Technician with the Technodrome, you can morph your Technician into a Catapult.

Back to my three pieces concept:

OK so to get this done there needs to be two new features.  The first is units that are not necessarily square, for example 1x3.  The second would probably be the ability of two units to merge together.  In this way, two adjascent wall units could join and become one.

There would be different types of wall parts.  Three basic types though:
1) A connecing part, it doesn't do anything special except link the other two together.
2) An attacking one that attacks like any other type.  Please note that this should be the only one that needs to be distroyed.  If distroyed, both the gates and the connecting pieces are too.  For example below the a's stand for attacking pieces, g's stand for gates, and numbers stand for connectors.

Code: [Select]

a12a34g56a78aIf the first attacker were distroyed, then connectors 1 and 2 would be as well.  But if the second attacker were distroyed, then numbers 1 through 6 and the gate would also be.
3) Gates would keep creeps out of your town, but would immediately allow any other unit through, whether it be enemy or friendly.

I really like the idea because it allows for so much creativity.  But I would also like to add another capability to this concept: stairways.  There can be several ways to do this.  The one I like best would be to have the attacking parts of each have a ladder or something that allows the units to climb it, (this would mean that each unit that could climb walls might need an animation for climbing; this would not necessarily be so because there could be an elevator or something like that, for instance which doesn't require anymore animations), and then when the unit gets to the top, he may move around as if it were another dimention; his pathfinding works as if he were in a maze becase he would only be able to walk if there were a walkable tile adjascent to him.

[Darth_Mascurse]

I agree that stairs would be cool, but still...the only thing that would be advantageous about it would be if you could increase the range of ranged units with it.  If that is the case, we should be able to "garrison" ranged units in buildings!

[John.d.h]

In Stronghold and Stronghold 2, you can build walls and then put archers and other military on them.  That's what we want!

Yes!  Stronghold did a really good job with walls.  I agree that the presence of flying units adds a new dimension to it, but I'm sure we can overcome that.

[modman]

The reason Stronghold could do such a good job was that it has a limited amount of units, so things can be "hard programmed" in very easily.

This is what I asked for before, but I was sorely voted down. :'(

[Idanwin]

Was playing around with Sketchup.
An idea for a wall,
Maybe, a "turret" could be placed on the top (Catapult, Ballista, Cannon), or a couple of units.

[@kukac@]

Or you could make walls a normal, narrow walking space. Hmm?