Author Topic: Glestimals  (Read 80052 times)

osiris

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« Reply #50 on: 29 June 2008, 20:14:18 »
is this still alive? because i can't wait to see this get up and running.
if you guys need an extra person to test or write xmls ill help.
and can i use the spider texture in an extension of the magic faction if i give credits?
« Last Edit: 1 January 1970, 00:00:00 by osiris »

wciow

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« Reply #51 on: 29 June 2008, 20:35:27 »
Yeah, this is still alive but I haven't had time to work on it for a couple of weeks. It will be updated soon and of course everything released so far is free to use and modify!
« Last Edit: 1 January 1970, 00:00:00 by wciow »
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Omega

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« Reply #52 on: 3 July 2008, 20:42:37 »
I could make xmls, but I'd rather wait till they are animated. Then I'll stick 'em in my tech tree (provided you give me permission of course)

So Wciow, what do you say?
« Last Edit: 1 January 1970, 00:00:00 by omega »
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ttsmj

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« Reply #53 on: 4 July 2008, 18:07:43 »
wciow there is one more issue... how would these animals be integrated into game? We need some kind of computer controlled neutral player. In age of empires this player was called "Gaia".

what do you guys think?

Quote from: "omega"
I could make xmls, but I'd rather wait till they are animated.

Why not animate them yourself?

Quote from: "omega"
(provided you give me permission of course)


My work is released under CC-BY-SA 2.0
« Last Edit: 1 January 1970, 00:00:00 by ttsmj »

Omega

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« Reply #54 on: 4 July 2008, 22:01:01 »
Well, I COULD animate them myself, as I'm slowly learning animation (I'm skilled with xmls, not animation) but I cannot get the blender export script to work, so I need help with that. Besides, I heard some people wanting to animate them already...
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nosoyjoe

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« Reply #55 on: 7 July 2008, 07:23:08 »
Are these animals going to be part of the tileset or enviroment?
« Last Edit: 1 January 1970, 00:00:00 by nosoyjoe »

Omega

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« Reply #56 on: 10 July 2008, 04:41:44 »
IDK, I'm personally hoping to see them as their own faction or for them to be implimented in the magitech.

BTW, Wciow, I used your bear model in the ancient techtree. You have been added to the credits. Anyone else who helped create the bear tell me so I can add you to the credits too. (the bear is now called the hell bear, sports a powerful attack and a spell called Hellhound)
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horusofoz

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #57 on: 10 December 2008, 03:02:29 »
I think it would be good to have a variety of neutral creeps (Or glestimals as you call them) that actually attack players. From wild bears or wolves, to demons, bandits, rogue mages etc. You could have them guarding resources or treasures, a small number on random patrols that have the potential for them to stroll into your village and start attacking. Also if possible maybe have low-to mid level creeps be respawned in certain areas, though high level creeps such as demons or dragons, are not respawned when killed. I suggest Warcraft 3 as a reference for this idea.

Also what would be mad is if by say Glest 5 or 6 we could develop the rpg elements for "hero" units as they did in warcraft 3. However I think before then we need to get the base game much more solidly set.

daniel.santos

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #58 on: 10 December 2008, 03:14:55 »
Good ideas, although I'm not necessarily interested making a WC3 clone.  I don't mind taking good ideas from here and there, but I like to keep possibility open.

My idea of the "glestimals" or "whats-its" is for visual purposes only.  If it goes beyond that (effecting game play) it'll need something different.  Originally, for "whats-its", I was thinking little low-polygon birds, snakes, rabbits, insects, deer, etc.  But I also like the idea of game-effecting units that do not belong to some certain enemy faction, that are "wild" or that are part of a non-standard faction, like the gnolls camping out somewhere.  Still, I prefer to stray from concepts that are a bit too worn out for me -- that the world is a place to be conquered and stolen from others and that anybody who stands in your way is a monster, although it should be supported in the engine if that's the type of mod/scenario/campaigns that somebody wants to write.  I admit that they are fun as well.

I presume you've read the relevant threads on heros (using a global hidden resource to restrict production or existence of more than x number of units to create a singular hero)?  So the other components are accumulating experience points instead of just kills and being able to pick up items, drop them, use them, be able to have a pool of "enhancement points" that you can use to increase stats of your choosing and other mechanisms to shape the growth of your character to your liking, etc.  There are lots of directions you can go to make it interesting, I don't think we'll see that in 0.3 though.

horusofoz

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #59 on: 10 December 2008, 07:45:01 »
Sorry I didn't mean to create a W3 clone. I just thought being OSS can take the best elements of many different games and pull together to make something better yet. W3 just has a few of those elements I think would be good to include. I think the extensibility of OSS means Glest should eventually be superior to Warcraft, not a Warcraft clone.

daniel.santos

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #60 on: 11 December 2008, 01:56:35 »
I sure hope so!! :)  Starcraft II will be out some time in '09 I think and it will be competition.  I'm hoping to have GAE looking good in it's face, although having so much money and development hours, I'm sure Blizzard could outdo Glest/GAE in a short time.  None the less, I GAE will have a range of extensibility that may be unparalleled, and that would be cool (if it's actually useful, etc.)

wciow

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #61 on: 11 December 2008, 19:05:44 »
Quote from: "daniel.santos"
I sure hope so!! :o

Back on topic, I agree with what Daniel said about not having WC3 style creeps. Personally I never really liked the RPG elements in RTS games (I'm more of a pure strategy guy). I think just having a few animals which wander the map and can be killed (but have no real game effect) is the way to go.
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modman

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #62 on: 14 December 2008, 22:35:41 »
I think they could be created by certain tileset objects, like stones or obelisks.  That way the number of creeps can remain constant; if one dies somewhere, another is created by a random tileset object.

daniel.santos

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #63 on: 15 December 2008, 08:45:32 »
I think he means creep as in "WC3 style creeping into GAE", not as in "freeps & creeps" of lotro or "creeps" as in "creatures" or non-team-aligned NPCs.  This conversation reminds me of a scene from Space Balls.

modman

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #64 on: 16 December 2008, 04:00:06 »
I have no idea what you're talking about.  I don't know what "Space Balls" is, I haven't seen lotr ( :'( ) and I have absolutely no intention of playing World of Warcraft.

What about the idea though?

daniel.santos

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #65 on: 16 December 2008, 16:48:45 »
Yea, I concur and I think others are in support of it too.  This is also important for the options for pet behavior that I have a "wild" faction to send optionally send pets to when the owner dies.  So I'm thinking having non-player "factions" with their own AI (less sophisticated though), and such units would have settings specifying how aggressive/passive they are, how they respond to attacks, and whatever else seems appropriate.  As far as maintaining a constant about of them, having them respawn and such, that should be optional if supported.

Also, it's lotro - "lord of the rings online" and we're not talking about world of warcraft, we're talking about warcraft 3 where there are obelisks guarded by gnolls and such and you have to kill them to get their treasure (sounds like how the united states [and others] got their land to me).

gameboy

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #66 on: 16 December 2008, 18:48:49 »
I think a better example for glestimals is in AOE3, also some should be conquerable, which if conquered will give the governing player a bonus, ex. capture a herd of oxen and get +5 food for every oxen captured.

verarticus

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #67 on: 16 December 2008, 21:53:53 »
how about the teams can have a "trainer" unit that could take control of (2 maybe?) glexamals and use them for whatever benefit food pet etc

daniel.santos

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #68 on: 16 December 2008, 23:52:28 »
hmm, that's very worth consideration actually.  While I'm against "style creep", people often become attached to features of other games and like to re-create them in their own games, and "capturing" animals for livestock was/is a big part of some AOE scenarios, as is hunting -- being able to kill a creature and harvest the meat for food.  One could just say to do it in lua once it's in, but I'm thinking that it's worth of consideration for integration into the engine its self, as long as it can be kept simple.

However, note that stability and multiplayer is top of the list right now and is still not under control. :(  None the less, here are my thoughts.

Capturing
I proposed this idea long ago for the FPM Lich, but it never made it's way in.  It basically involves the ability for a unit of one team to take control of a unit from another team.  For my proposal (for FPM), I wanted to limit the number of units the lich could control, give enlightenment a mechanism to retake control of their units and give the controlling faction a kill for the death of the controlled unit (and the original faction a "death") -- so the state of the controlled unit (having been originally from another faction) is never lost.  Additionally, there is a master/slave relationship between the lich and the controlled unit that should be lost if the lich dies (or perhaps even if he is stunned, paralyzed, turned to stone, etc.)  In fantasy lore, there are often spells used to control others, so it's more than possible that such a scenario could pop up again with somebody else's mod.

As for the "animal tamer", they would probably want to execute some skill (like the lich) to gain control of the foreign unit.  But for AOE-style livestock capturing, it's an implicit action that occurs when any unit comes near the foreign livestock unit.  So if I do this feature, I want there to be a well thought-out framework that will accommodate all of theses scenarios.  Also, for the animal tamer, they may not want to maintain the same master/slave relationship that FPM liches do -- so  once an animal is tamed, it stays that way and the tamer can go on to tame as many animals as they like, get killed, etc.

Hunting
Some others have already requested the ability to transform a unit when they die, this could extend upon that functionality.  Essentially, it would transform the unit into something that's harvestable (optionally with the slowly decreasing resource count as in AOE).

modman

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #69 on: 17 December 2008, 02:33:39 »
Wkiow I know you'll be mad at me (or any variation of mad) for saying this, but maybe the creatures should be a little more fantasy-like.  They should probably also vary by tileset so that the Forset creatures are slightly different than Winter Forest creatures.  This could be as simple as a reskin.

 :!:  :!:  :!:  !

For the harmful ones, some kind of troll would be nice for the guarding one, a goblin for the roaming, and a wolf for another roaming but stronger.

The beneficial ones could be simply gnomes.  Example:
Code: [Select]
[img]http://images.netshops.com/mgen/master:AEI063.jpg[/img]
« Last Edit: 8 October 2016, 00:15:52 by filux »

gameboy

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #70 on: 17 December 2008, 03:16:23 »
Quote from: "modman"
Beneficial ones would give resources when you captured (killed really, but they respawn from specific tileset objects.)
not just resources, but bonuses, fir example if you capture a horse the move speed of all horses and mounted units increase by a small amount say .25 % maybe less, it would increase with every horse captured, there could also be a pen to put all the captured animals to avoid a congested base, they would just disappear in the building if the building is destroyed then they come out.
This could also be applied to stationary objects (the bonuses not the pen), say a ruin of an ancient civilization, capture it and get faster training speed for all units, however it need some units in its vicinity, or it will be captured by the next unit passing by who has the building in its LOS, and if this happens all the benefits from the captured unit or building would be lost to the particular player.

wciow

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #71 on: 17 December 2008, 15:29:40 »
Quote from: modman
Wkiow I know you'll be mad at me (or any variation of mad) for saying this, but maybe the creatures should be a little more fantasy-like.

I don't mind fantasy creatures at all. I made the current Glestimals as real animals since they can be used in all mods not just fantasy ones. If someone is making a modern military mod having gnomes and trolls roaming around is a bit strange.

If you really want fantasy creeps then I have already made a goblin and a troll.




 
Quote from: modman
They should probably also vary by tileset so that the Forset creatures are slightly different than Winter Forest creatures.  This could be as simple as a reskin.

Sounds like a good idea but its up to Daniel to decide how creeps are implemented. I just make the models  :)
« Last Edit: 8 October 2016, 00:16:10 by filux »
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Omega

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #72 on: 17 December 2008, 15:49:43 »
OT: The troll should be shown on the improving magic thread in general discussion. We sure could use a troll!
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modman

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #73 on: 17 December 2008, 23:09:10 »
I love them!  The troll would be best for the one that guards the area, and the Goblin is nice as a roaming weak creature.   :!:
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[img]http://www.foxdie.co.uk/images/zazzle%20werewolf.jpg[/img]
Daniel, how do you like my ideas so far?
« Last Edit: 8 October 2016, 00:16:39 by filux »

daniel.santos

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Re: Glestimals
« Reply #74 on: 18 December 2008, 20:19:48 »
nice creeps wciow! :) ).

So gameboy, the idea of captures causing bonuses, but only so long as an item/building/wild unit is captured can become a very remarkable tool for fun variant games (maybe you or somebody else mentioned this before) -- I'm thinking along the lines of CTF (capture the flag) types of game variants and such, perhaps even a game type that is on-going games where players can join and drop at any time and vacant slots are taken over by AI or abandon or something.  I'm just thinking outside of the box here, and perhaps I've even rolled off on the floor and outside into the garden, but I don't see why any restrictions should be placed on possibility. (don't expect me to code anything like that in the near future though!!  :P  )

None the less, I think we have a pretty descent base specification for Glestimals
  • Standard "whats-its" -- specified in the tileset - (see
Code: [Select]
[url=http://glest.org/glest_board/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=3387]http://glest.org/glest_board/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=3387[/url]
    ) that are specified in an animated tileset (an advanced tileset) and are completely non-game effecting.  Whats-its will respond to player interaction (i.e., running from players, etc.) but will not effect game play at all (I.e., purely eye candy).[/li]
  • "Creeps" - specified in the scenario - are either hostile or have an AI specified in the scenario.
  • Capturables - specified in the scenario
  • Huntables -- probably just a flag set on a unit with a pre-specified food value and decay rate?
That's roughly it.  I'll get more into designing that later.  I'm working on networking code now so I don't want to think too much on it today.
« Last Edit: 8 October 2016, 00:17:12 by filux »

 

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