Should we tune magic?

[verarticus]

I've heard the shapeshifter suggested before but what whould it benefit?   ...Maybe Ill try to redo a Novamage I was working on (not a new model unfortunately) but when I had it in the magic I modded it realy seamed to balance it...I dont know Ill try.
another thing that might help is an actual riding unit with a strong attack cause the draken rider thing is utterly useless -_-

[gameboy]

i'd suggest a unit that was mounted and had a melee as the primary attack, with a splash.
How about a drake chariot?
Or maybe a Land Dragon Rider, it could be called Heavy Raider.
Or just a fast Beast, say a Worm ( Not Earthworms, Dragon Worms), it could attack with speed and have a special attack that could kill a unit instantly.

[verarticus]

i'd suggest a unit that was mounted and had a melee as the primary attack, with a splash.
How about a drake chariot?
Or maybe a Land Dragon Rider, it could be called Heavy Raider.
Or just a fast Beast, say a Worm ( Not Earthworms, Dragon Worms), it could attack with speed and have a special attack that could kill a unit instantly.

its wyerm btw
and I had an Idea how about a dark mage knight? (i'll try to find a picture) but It would have high armour and morph from the battlemage it would have a decent attack with a mid power magic attack.

[Omega]

IDEAS:

• Allow ghost armor to morph into some stronger version. I don't really know what, but some type of more powerful melee unit that isn't too different. Maybe a dark knight or something. He could have a second powerful attack that deals some damage to himself as well as huge damage to the foe. (this is done by giving him some splash. He ends up injuring himself too with the splash)
• Create a troll (?) or some other powerful melee unit that is preferably 1 in size, since bigger units have trouble walking. It could be produced from the archmage tower to make the tower more useful.

Oh, a shapeshifter would be pretty cool too.

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[img]http://images.quizfarm.com/1136658597shapeshift.JPG[/img]It could tranform into a number of beasts, such as a wolf, hawk, etc; Models from Glestimals could help. The animals would be nothing out of the ordinary, but could still have their uses (hawk would swoop down and attack, wolf would be a fast unit that attacked with its teeth, so on)

[mictes]

Whuuu this guy is sooo ugly ! ^^
No it is a good idea, but it could a little bit complicate gameplay.

[verarticus]

The splash thing wont work cause they (and anything near) would take the same damage

[modman]

I would strongly suggest my idea since I had to almost research this to get it.  Behemoth is the only unit that wouldn't go with anything, and I see that Hellgate is left wide open; it's asking for a new unit that requires it.

Magic also doesn't need four new units; it only needs one, maybe two.   For the second possible unit I would recommend another ridden upon unit, some sort of beast rider, like this:

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[img]http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/4695/hlu2f7vr020je4rs.jpg[/img]

[verarticus]

I'm agreeing with the Hell fire upgrade part and The beast looks cool : ) but wouldn't it be another big one?

[John.d.h]

Brainstorming:

More powerful Drake Rider (Drake Lancer / Drake Knight / whatever else you wanna call it)
Some light flying unit that you could pair with the Behemoth to counter the Battle Machine and Ornithopter duo.  Griffin rider?
I like the idea of having an upgrade for the Ghost Armo(u)r.  I was thinking something along the lines of Iron Knuckle from the Legend of Zelda series.

[verarticus]

how about the black Darknut (I think they're called that?) the huge Knights would be pretty cool and would fit perfectly!

[John.d.h]

how about the black Darknut (I think they're called that?) the huge Knights would be pretty cool and would fit perfectly!

Also cool.

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[img]http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/zelda/images/4/49/Darknut.jpg[/img]

[Omega]

SWEET! Legend of Zelda darknuts! Roll around them and backslash em to kill! Just make normal human sized one (the original size is a bit big) and we have the 100% perfect dark night (why didnt I think of that?).

[John.d.h]

<off topic>

Legend of Zelda has plenty of units, factions, etc, for its own mod if somebody wanted to make one...

</off topic>

[verarticus]

<off topic>

Legend of Zelda has plenty of units, factions, etc, for its own mod if somebody wanted to make one...

</off topic>

It would be best for a Gae faction (zelda hero with heal link hero witch could have free quick morph for different items)
and I can tell thats a darknut but...from which game cause I dont think it looks like the one's in twilight.

anyway ya I thought that would fit. sure not full size but a bit bigger than the normal human unit.

[John.d.h]

It would be best for a Gae faction (zelda hero with heal link hero witch could have free quick morph for different items)
and I can tell thats a darknut but...from which game cause I dont think it looks like the one's in twilight.

I think it's from "Twilight Princess", but I'm only really familiar with "Link to the Past" and "Ocarina of Time", so I'm not really sure.  What I was actually thinking for the mod was more along the lines of a traditional RTS.

Forces of evil:
Units: Moblin (heavy spear-thrower), ReDead (slow-moving zombie), Gibdo (upgraded from ReDead), Iron Knuckle (super heavy infantry, very slow but hits really hard), Keese (light fast-attack unit, promotes to Fire Keese), Sorcerer, Lizalfos (agile infantry unit)
Heroes: Ganondorf/Ganon, Agahnim (Sorcerer hero), Dark Link
Buildings: Dark Castle, Dungeon, Monster Lair, Beamos (turret that fires energy beams)
Upgrades: Mummification (required for Gibdos), Horror (lets ReDead and Gibdo curse enemies)

Hyrule:
Units: Hylian Soldiers (various kinds), Ball and Chain Trooper, Sheikah Shadow Warrior (fast movement and attack), Priest of the Light (heals and buffs), Sheikah Shadow Mage, Adventurer (medium unit with both melee and ranged attacks), Mounted Adventurer
Heroes: Link (Adventurer hero), Zelda (Priest hero), Sheik (Shadow Warrior hero), Impa (Shadow Mage hero)
Buildings: Castle, Temple of Light,
Upgrades: Epona's Song (lets Adventurer morph into Mounted Adventurer)

Gorons:
Units: Brawler, Hammerer, Tumbler (attacks by rolling into the enemy at high speeds), Bomb-thrower, Giant Goron, Dodongo (fire-breathing lizard)
Heroes: Darunia (Hammerer hero), Dangoro (Brawler hero)
Buildings: Goron City, Bombworks, Smithy, Quarry (provides food)
Upgrades: Megaton Hammer, Dodongo Taming

Gerudo:
Units: Soldier (light infantry with a glaive-like polearm), Fighter (armed with twin scimitars), Archer, Cavalry, Witch, Thief
Heroes: Nabooru (Thief hero), Koume and Kotake (Witch heroes)
Buildings: Fortress, Training Ground, Thieves' Den, Desert Colossus
Upgrades: Mounted Archery (gives Cavalry a ranged attack)

Zoras:
(Nothing yet, but maybe when/if water travel gets implemented...)

Deku:
Units: Deku Scrub, Mad Scrub, Peahat, Skull Kid, Skulltulla (heavily-armored giant spider)
Buildings: Deku Baba (bites anything that comes near)

[verarticus]

It would be best for a Gae faction (zelda hero with heal link hero witch could have free quick morph for different items)
and I can tell thats a darknut but...from which game cause I dont think it looks like the one's in twilight.

I think it's from "Twilight Princess", but I'm only really familiar with "Link to the Past" and "Ocarina of Time", so I'm not really sure. What I was actually thinking for the mod was more along the lines of a traditional RTS.

Forces of evil:
Moblins (heavy infantry trooper), ReDead (zombie, promotes into Gibdos), Iron Knuckle (super heavy infantry, very slow but hits really hard), Keese (light fast-attack unit, promotes to Fire Keese), Beamos (stationary defense unit that fires an energy beam)
Heroes: Ganondorf, Ganon, Agahnim, Dark Link

Hyrule:
Hylian Soldiers (various kinds), Ball and Chain Trooper, Shiekah Shadow Warrior
Heroes: Link, Zelda (heals and buffs)

Gorons:
Brawler, Tumbler (attacks by rolling into the enemy at high speeds), Bomb-thrower, Giant Goron, Dodongo (fire-breathing lizard)
Hero: Darunia (very strong Goron with a big hammer)

exactly...I would work better for  Gae team because there you can have buffs and bla and that would also keep from haveing 10000 heros ending up on the feild X D

btw: maybe it is from Twilight Princess...guess I was to buisy fighting them to notice the details but I thought they had a more...stony look to the sword and armour...guess not.

[John.d.h]

exactly...I would work better for  Gae team because there you can have buffs and bla and that would also keep from haveing 10000 heros ending up on the feild X D

I definitely agree with you there.  There are just a lot of features that aren't available in regular Glest yet that would make it so much better.  If I weren't already working on Sun and Moon, I'd be working on putting this plan into action as we speak.  Unfortunately, this will have to wait for some later date unless someone else feels like doing it.  Sigh... so many ideas, so little time.

Okay, I think I'm done hijacking this thread.  Shall we return to the matter at hand?

[modman]

I definitely think that because the behemoth doesn't have a companion unit that really suits it (that rules out battlemage because it is too weak of an attack for an expensive unit, and archmages because of their deadly splash) it needs a unit that has a ranged attack and has either a damage all value: false; or, more likely, has little or no splash.  The wolf would have an attack with a range of at least seven.  This is my best match to something from Hell, so if nobudy has any reasonable objection, I would say this should be the unit.

[verarticus]

I definitely think that because the behemoth doesn't have a companion unit that really suits it (that rules out battlemage because it is too weak of an attack for an expensive unit, and archmages because of their deadly splash) it needs a unit that has a ranged attack and has either a damage all value: false; or, more likely, has little or no splash. The wolf would have an attack with a range of at least seven. This is my best match to something from Hell, so if nobudy has any reasonable objection, I would say this should be the unit.

a wolf...with 7 range... that makes perfect sence. and we can't set splash to hit all false cause it dosen't work. and maybe we souldn't partner the behemoth cause of movement trouble and it seems realy weak (It says up to 350 damage but I dont think it does cause 3-5 hits for swordman is pathetic) maybe we need 2 new units or a unit with a range and close range attack.

[John.d.h]

Since the Battle Machine goes so well with the Ornithopter, maybe we need a light flying unit to go with the Behemoth, and since we're talking about Hellgate here, it could be some kind of winged demon that throws fireballs or something.

[modman]

Now you're thinking!  Some kind of bat or something!  It should be a big bat though, so radius 2.  This is because ALL flying units need to be more than 1 tile radius or else anti-air won't work.

Also, how should it be made?  With a Summoner?

[John.d.h]

I think the Summoner has enough work to do already.  Maybe something along the lines of how the Behemoth is summoned.  Have an Initiate draw a pentacle on the ground and summon the monster through there?  Or does that sound a little too Satanic?

[modman]

Satanic is where we're going here.  Remember it's Hellgate.  I like that idea a lot.  I like the pentacle idea more than the Bat idea though.

But getting whatever morphs from the pentacle would be the same number of steps as Behemoth, so that's great!

Maybe something like this

[John.d.h]

:twisted:

[horusofoz]

More like the driver of the crazy train