Should we tune magic?

[hailstone]

Is it possible for one unit to transform another unit into a different unit? Say a summoner transforms a initiate into a lich. Rather than have it transform on its own.

[verarticus]

Is it possible for one unit to transform another unit into a different unit? Say a summoner transforms a initiate into a lich. Rather than have it transform on its own.

*offtopic kinda* isnt a lich suppost to be a person who was evil and died but couldnt got to rest? so the summoner killed the evil initiatives to make them liches  

[John.d.h]

I'm not a big fan of the undead idea.  That's just not the kind of feeling I get from the Magic faction.

[modman]

Me niether.  The picture I have is not of an undead guy though.  He's just really frail.  I'm not sure where he fits into Magic, though.

[verarticus]

well he looks like a necromancer to me but he ties in to the dead...

[titi]

I currently think, that I will lower the golems EP problem a bit.
Another thing I(personally) really like is the idea of the rotating defense obelisk, but that is not something that helps a cpu player.
Humans will like and use it!

I will try these things ingame in the next days.

[modman]

Actually, I was thinking of giving the Golem another attack, an air attack.  The attack would be called "seismic smash" or something.  It could have a particle proj model of land shooting up from the ground.  The model of the Golem would look like the Golem is smashing the ground with his hands and all the earth comes up in front of him.

Also, the attack would have a splash, so it will actually be effective against air units, and will be impact of course.  I would also recommend removing EP restrictions on the Golem's movement.

[verarticus]

Actually, I was thinking of giving the Golem another attack, an air attack. The attack would be called "seismic smash" or something. It could have a particle proj model of land shooting up from the ground. The model of the Golem would look like the Golem is smashing the ground with his hands and all the earth comes up in front of him.

Also, the attack would have a splash, so it will actually be effective against air units, and will be impact of course. I would also recommend removing EP restrictions on the Golem's movement.

that would be cool but dosent seem right for an air attack maybe as a special attack that requires ep to use and is ground aoe

[modman]

Yes, by removing the EP from the move skill, the Golem could now have EP cost for the air attack.  I was thinking about that, and if you think it's a good idea, then lets go with it.

All I really need for this is 3 models: Golem attacking (secondary), particle proj model (should look like an incriminating jut of rock that was smashed out of the ground), and the smaller rocks for the splash.

The attack can be "tuned" (like how I used that, titi? =] ) to be balenced.  It could even require a certain building to use, if it has a land-air area of effect.  That would really make Magic cool to play!

[John.d.h]

I currently think, that I will lower the golems EP problem a bit.
Another thing I(personally) really like is the idea of the rotating defense obelisk, but that is not something that helps a cpu player.
Humans will like and use it!

I will try these things ingame in the next days.

Wait, what?  The whole idea of the Golem is that it's a defensive structure with a tiny bit of mobility.  I'm fairly positive it's not intended to be an assault unit, and if it has no EP requirement for movement, then that's exactly what it will become.  That's what the Behemoth is for.  I think if you want to tune magic, tune the Behemoth or make a promotion for Ghost Armor (Magic Armor?  Whatever they're calling it these days...).

[mictes]

@modman:

I tried the defense_obelisk with the cpu, too.
The CPU uses them, too !

[Omega]

For now, why don't you try downloading my Pumpkin Ghost unit for Magic? (See Happy Halloween topic in General Discussion)
It's main attack is impact, which is rare among magic units, with just the golem having a ranged impact. Its main attack is a pumpkin toss which deals roughly the same damage that the archmage does with no splash (no killing your own units, woo hoo!) but is faster, uses less EP and stuff. The pumpkin ghost requires an archmage to get, and is summoned from the summoner. It has MUCH more HP than the archmage, which sheds that disadvantage, but it still seems balanced.

Tell me what you think! (And don't shun the idea, download the unit!)

[verarticus]

For now, why don't you try downloading my Pumpkin Ghost unit for Magic? (See Happy Halloween topic in General Discussion)
It's main attack is impact, which is rare among magic units, with just the golem having a ranged impact. Its main attack is a pumpkin toss which deals roughly the same damage that the archmage does with no splash (no killing your own units, woo hoo!) but is faster, uses less EP and stuff. The pumpkin ghost requires an archmage to get, and is summoned from the summoner. It has MUCH more HP than the archmage, which sheds that disadvantage, but it still seems balanced.

Tell me what you think! (And don't shun the idea, download the unit!)

yes the unit is cool but its more of a hallowen we need a differnet look but ya its good

[titi]

@johndh:
Good point!
I think I will tune the behemoth. I will give him a range weapon too thats what he needs! But I think he will get no air attack, because magic already has enough air attacks.

[John.d.h]

@johndh:
Good point!
I think I will tune the behemoth. I will give him a range weapon too thats what he needs! But I think he will get no air attack, because magic already has enough air attacks.

Boulder toss, perhaps?

[verarticus]

@johndh:
Good point!
I think I will tune the behemoth. I will give him a range weapon too thats what he needs! But I think he will get no air attack, because magic already has enough air attacks.

Boulder toss, perhaps?

dosent the golem kinda hav that? (unless the change removes that) maybe some big wooden spears or something like that.

[modman]

No, only on the smallest maps will the Golem become a powerful unit.  Otherwise, Magic has no real good defense against early air units (Ornthopters especially).  And the "sonic smash" attack will only be an air attack, so it won't effect any ground units.

If you want, you could take away th EP restrictions on the air attack so that you could keep EP restrictions on the Golem's move skill...

[verarticus]

No, only on the smallest maps will the Golem become a powerful unit. Otherwise, Magic has no real good defense against early air units (Ornthopters especially). And the "sonic smash" attack will only be an air attack, so it won't effect any ground units.

If you want, you could take away th EP restrictions on the air attack so that you could keep EP restrictions on the Golem's move skill...

ok hear what your actually saying about the sonic smash.

Actually, I was thinking of giving the Golem another attack, an air attack. The attack would be called "seismic smash" or something. It could have a particle proj model of land shooting up from the ground. The model of the Golem would look like the Golem is smashing the ground with his hands and all the earth comes up in front of him.

Also, the attack would have a splash, so it will actually be effective against air units, and will be impact of course. I would also recommend removing EP restrictions on the Golem's movement.

ok if it shoots up from the ground then of coarse the units under the attack area wouldnt get hit! WRONG!
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<> units ^ attack

im just saying maybe if its only for air thats not the best chose...

[modman]

OK, fine.  Then the attack can require the Summoner's Guild or the Library.

[gameboy]

How about a beast or animal kinda thing it has no ranged attack, but has a special attack that kills a unit instantly.
For the special attack we could use ep, ex. make it cost 100 and have 100 ep with re-gen 5 and have an attack enough to kill a unit but not enough for a building.

[modman]

I kind of like the Golem idea best.  But it's all up to whoever makes the models!

[Omega]

For the golem, have an parabolic attack that has a very high arc, so that it seems to go straight up and straight down. Never actually tried it, but...

[modman]

It would actually be linear, but:

Hasn't anyone seen a movie where something shoots out of the ground from shifting land?  Like the Star Treck Movies?

[Omega]

Yeah, but that would have to be land AND air then.

[modman]

No it wouldn't.  It you set the fields of the attack in the attack skill and the particle proj has nothing to do with the fields.