Elf Faction 0.9.7 & 2.0A (Both MG Compatible)

[andy_5995]

I do hope you kept with the original idea of expensive and very strong units. 

Don't worry. I will be consulting more with my associates as to what changes should be made. I'd like to give others a free hand at fine tuning.

I tried to do as few changes as possible, but I did cheapen some things in order to balance things out. I included the Elves as an 8th faction with ZetaPack, so spent quite a bit of time experimenting with balance.

One particular change I didn't really want to make: instead of the corral morphing into a corral_gryphon_nest, I had to set it so an elf could build the nest. For some reason the AI would never morph the corral.

I know the AI will morph buildings; I once experimented with an Indian mod and enabled a main_teepee to morph into a flying_main_teepee (giving it beehive technology in the process). The AI morphed it while playing.

I think one problem is that when the corral morphs, it needs space on the side, however, it may be blocked by other units, mobile or otherwise.

But if a modeller comes along and changes the corral_gryphon_nest so it gets taller, instead of wider, I would definitely want to try testing again with the corral morphing.

[andy_5995]

I do hope you kept with the original idea of expensive and very strong units. 

@Archmage: This should be more clear, a page with the Elves faction characteristics: https://zetaglest.github.io/elves_overview.html

[jammyjamjamman]

@Archmage, I have a problem with the Grey Elf archer melee attack model. The texture isn't linking correctly (I think the problem is with the sword).

I got your source material from here:

Download - Elves Faction Source Material - 198MB 7z

I selected the grey elf archer blend file. However, I couldn't work out how to activate the melee attack animation, if it's contained in there. I was wondering if you could give me pointers on how to do this? (or supply a model with the texture error corrected ;-) ).

Thanks!

Quick update, it looks like I misunderstood the problem after reading what andy5995 discovered about the missing textures in elves. It turns out another texture is really missing, but he couldn't locate it.

[-Archmage-]

If I didn't change a texture during development, I would've just linked to the one already in the faction. No point in creating duplicates all over the place.

[jammyjamjamman]

If I didn't change a texture during development, I would've just linked to the one already in the faction. No point in creating duplicates all over the place.

Thanks for the info. It turns out there's a problem with texture linking in many of the models. There's a lot of models linked to .tga textures, but the saved textures are actually .png. It's not a major problem because the megaglest engine doesn't seem to mind this, but sometimes errors are thrown in the terminal and the g3d blender importer/ exporter is very unhappy about it.

[val-gaav]

Hmm unfortunately I missed these updates. What we lack here is a license declaration. To make it distributable with MG it needs to be a compatible license.

there was a declaration from Gameboy a while ago:
https://forum.megaglest.org/index.php?topic=5351.msg77068#msg77068

cc-by-sa

[Pizza90]

Any update on this? It would be cool having this faction in the mod center.

Anyone willing to keep up working on this?

[Pizza90]

Original thread:

https://forum.megaglest.org/index.php?topic=3944.0

Licensed under: CC-BY-SA

Very cool faction which IMHO should be added in the mod center.

[andy_5995]

Today (after reading your post), I prepared the Elves for MegaGlest and it can be downloaded from elves_A2.7z

The repo for it is at https://github.com/zetaglest/elves-testing

It will need some play-testing before it's added to the server and mod-center.

The issues section on the GitHub repo can be used to report any problems or make feature suggestions.

[Pizza90]

Hey Andy! Wow great!
Do you have a list of issues to be fixed?? What do you feel needs testing?
What time is good for playing? I am GMT+1.
I have been playing a couple of matches against the computerr and found something that can be worked on. I will make a list asap.

Edit: sanctuary does not have a meeting point this has to be fixed

Also silly question...but how do you obtain grace??

[andy_5995]

No list of issues yet. Me and Jammy had some discussions about it and made some adjustments when we worked on it for ZetaGlest. It's very playable, but some minor things may need changing. We played the A2 download today.

Peak playing times are around 20:00 - 23:00 UTC. If you join #megaglest-lobby on Freenode IRC, you can catch a game a lot more easily. We will often wait up to 10 minutes to start a game if a player lets us know that he/she will be joining.

The A2 version that I prepared is a little different than older downloads mentioned in this thread. The meeting point for sanctuaries isn't needed because they no longer produce elves.

Grace is provided by the sanctuaries (not a silly question)

[Pizza90]

I will definitively join if we play elves I will try to stick around that time for a game this week.

Is a changelog with your changes available? I gave a look on github but saw only a couple of commits for cosmetic reasons (adding a preview image etc.), no trace of modification to the game.

[titi]

Problems I saw while playing it:

<titi_linux> andy5995[m],  it was too easy to win, because the random AI behaviour did not made enough strong fighters
<titi_linux> a problem are unbalanced units like those trees
<titi_linux> slow and not enough attack power ( they should have a lot of splash damage with theri big rocks )
<titi_linux> AI does not take unit effectiveness into account when making fighters

Teamcolor is often not visible enough. For trees maybe a better particle effect using teamcolor can be used to fix it.

Its very complicated to build the main tree because you need several upgrades. Its a bit non intuitive because you start with a unit like this gameplay gets lame with this. You cannot expand early as strategy.

AI city is much too crowded. Problem is wrong unit size and maybe an additional "AI build size" is needed to fix this.

[andy_5995]

I will definitively join if we play elves I will try to stick around that time for a game this week.

Is a changelog with your changes available? I gave a look on github but saw only a couple of commits for cosmetic reasons (adding a preview image etc.), no trace of modification to the game.

No, there's isn't a changelog. And the reason the commit log is so short is because last year when I made all the changes (starting from what was available here in this thread), I was working from the ZetaGlest data repo. Since then, I removed the elves from the ZG data repo created a separate repo for it.

As for changes from this point forward, I'm not sure i'd want to maintain a ChangeLog. So many minor changes happen, and a week later something might get reverted or changed again with something like this. Once it's stable all the players will know how to play after just a few tries so for that reason, too, I'm not sure it would be worth my time to maintain a ChangeLog.

[titi]

not poolished enough yet.
balance, AI playablility, teamcolor adn so on is missing. Mod center is for things that are ready to play.

[andy_5995]

titi, how is this for building spacing?

https://imgur.com/htLm56g

[andy_5995]

The latest snapshot download: elves_A4 tested by me and Jammy.

[Pizza90]

Thank you! I will download it and let you know

[Pizza90]

I did not have time to join any game tonight but I eventually played against CPU. Here are my feedbacks (some, I am sure already noticed by others):

- Compared to previous versions this one is more fluid, the others took ages, but I do miss workers not requiring wood (I suppose it was their characteristic being elves).

- The sanctuary still has a meeting point which should be removed since it is not used.

- Dryads have color attacks but otherwise they are indistinguishable, maybe it is a personal preference but I don't like all those tones of green.

- It would be cool if the tree of life could be thickened, right now it looks almost like a normal tree, in doing that you could find room for color stripes like in the guardian tree.

- Color strips of guardian tree should be thickened (maybe the whole model too?)

- Mine and wood harvesting have the same icons I find it so confusing 

- It would be cool having a color flag on academy (like corral has)

- Team color should be added to elf archers.

- I feel 180 wood for elf archer is a lot  Maybe 120g/150w or 100g/180w would be better

- Same for reaver,  180 gold and 220 wood seems a lot, I would try 150g/200w or 180g/200w.

- I don't know why but playing this faction I always end up with massive unbalances between gold and wood.. like 5 (or more) more gold than wood or vice versa, which does not happen with other factions, does it happen to you too?

[andy_5995]

Oh those are all good suggestions or valid observations. I also felt like there is too much "green" with the elves.

There are some issues already opened on the repo for what you've listed. The meeting point from sanctuaries I removed last night.

But the items in your list need individual issues opened on the repo, so they can be addressed individually, discussed if necessary. But all good feedback you gave, thank you for testing it, Pizza90.

I don't know why but playing this faction I always end up with massive unbalances between gold and wood.. like 5 (or more) more gold than wood or vice versa, which does not happen with other factions, does it happen to you too?

Yes! And to other players who have helped me test it. I think that will get easier when players can anticipate their needs better as they learn how much units cost. They'll likely still be some adjustments to that.

but I do miss workers not requiring wood (I suppose it was their characteristic being elves).

It seems like the AI does better at the start when it needs just gold for workers and not wood. I tested with multiple combinations and they didn't seem to be playing/producing correctly until I changed the cost of an elf to 75 gold and 0 wood.

[andy_5995]

Pizza90, I did most of the items in your list (check the commit log). A few I'm not sure if I can do them because I'm not a graphic or blender artist, but tickets can be created still and hopefully sometime they'll get done, if not by me then someone else.

[andy_5995]

current snapshot, elves_A5.7z is available for download.

I've included faction links for the east_vs_mega mod, so that must be downloaded from the MegaGlest mod center before playing.

commit (ChangeLog

[Pizza90]

Did a single player elf vs elf and I am glad to see improvements!(and that you followed some of my suggestions ) The only thing I find too much is the saturation of teamcolor in archers as compared to other units looks too vivid and unrealistic, maybe you can tone it down a bit? (a la workers' team color).
At the leas for me the gameplay has improved noticeably so thank you Andy! More feedbacks to come

[andy_5995]

Here's version A6

Pizza, I fixed most everything, and created tickets for the rest. Thanks a bunch.

[Pizza90]

Hey Andy glad to see a new version out, thanks a lot for your work!

I haven't installed it yet but here are more feedbacks from previous versions:

- Guardian Forest still has meeting point but it is useless so it should be removed
- Playing against CPU I noticed that many of my units (non-workers) are created with about 1/5 of their energy missing, have you noticed this too?

Edit: I gave a quick try so I am editing this.
- Since you changed the team color of trees I don't think they need to be thickened any more, (pretty cool way to show the team color btw!)
- Do you feel adding a sanctuary at the beginning is ok or too powerful? Since there is already the guardian forest as starter. I think it was balanced also without sanctuary but that's my 2 cents.