Dwarves Aglarond 0.1.2 released !

[jda]

After the war, Gimli the Dwarf, who fought in that battle, established a colony of Durin's folk there. Aglarond lay in front of a huge and very beautiful cave system, which proved irresistible to him.

source: Wikipedia

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[img]http://img267.imageshack.us/img267/725/screen30p.jpg[/img]
This is the Aglarond release of the Dwarf faction.
As the previous release, declared by wciow as his last personal release of the Dwarves, was named Gimli, I thought it would be fit to name the next one, the result of "Gimli's work", as Aglarond, where Gimli founded and ruled a new Dwarf city.

Dwarves - Aglarond 0.1.2p2 download link: http://www.mediafire.com/file/f2smxb3bm0od8mm/dwarves-aglarond-0.1.2p2.7z (24.9 MB)
The above release now includes the two patches linked bellow. In case you already have the original 0.1.2 unpatched, or with patch 1 only, you can get the patches linked below and just copy its contents to your currently installed Dwarves folder:
Patch 1 (mainly fixes the Goat sounds, see this post for details) download link: http://www.mediafire.com/file/2zhz14k83yda0hl/dwarves-aglarond-0.1.2-patch1.7z (231 KB)
Patch 2! (slight improvement to the goat animations, see this other post for details), download link: http://www.mediafire.com/file/ceji3wdv04yx8v4/dwarves-aglarond-0.1.2-patch2.7z (75 KB)

"Extras":
* wciow's excellent The Three Towers scenario, developed for the former Dwarves Gimli release, will work just as well with Dwarves Aglarond. Thread link: https://forum.megaglest.org/index.php?topic=4548.msg28996#msg28996
* Little Helper's very nice Tears of the Outriders wallpaper. Thread link: https://forum.megaglest.org/index.php?topic=5068.msg39372#msg39372

Old Dwarf faction's thread: https://forum.megaglest.org/index.php?topic=3695.0


Roadmap:
* Aglarond 0.1 RELEASED!
   - Unit/model sizes, ranges and cellmap fixes (included work in XML's, 3D models and animations)
   - Projectiles, particles and splashes (addition/edition of 3D models and XML's)
   - Techtree reordering (requisites reordering basically, for buildings, units and upgrades)
   - Balancing and stuff (units' stats editing and more). Note this included the addition of the Tech pig! (will be replaced by a proper Dwarf goat soon enough )
   - Other minor fixes.
* Aglarond 0.1.1 RELEASED!
   - Minor fix for an ugly bug. See here: https://forum.megaglest.org/index.php?topic=5187.msg42613#msg42613
* Aglarond 0.1.2 RELEASED!
   - Intermediate release between 0.1.1 and 0.2 (other releases may follow before the entire planned 0.2 release comes out)
   - Includes a brand new unit: the Goat;
   - Published modified textures (improved team color) for the Guardian and the Outrider;
   - XML work - balance, improving gameplay, ...
   - For a little more detail on this release, se post: https://forum.megaglest.org/index.php?topic=5187.msg79202#msg79202
* Aglarond 0.2
   - Texture work:
      . Team color: Guardian, Dragon slayer and Outrider need to have team color added on (they currently have none). Note: the Dragon slayer model will be edited prior to this (cape will be added).
      . (Soon to be included) new units texturing: Goat and Skyship. Possibly a new building too (have the plans, half the model done, need some permission, some more modelling ...)
      . Team color on buildings. There's none on: farm, foundry, rhinox pen, stronghold. Try and add some. At the lack of more inspired/original solutions, go for "dwarven straigth banners" along the sides or corners!
   - Finish resizing and stuff! Actually all construction and destructions models are still the same as they were before. They will all need to be redone according to the new base-models. The Bombard may need further reducing too. The Stronghold may have its ceiling lowered down a tiny bit. Maybe more... Verify and finish this up, what the heck!
   - Update: Three models will need new animations for this release: Dragon slayer (WIP), Goat (WIP) and Outrider (WIP).
* Aglarond 0.3
   - Animate!
      . Use -Archmage-'s new armature to do the engineer's walk. Then copy that armature and animation to each unit that is made up of a standing dwarf. This new armature will be used to redo all animations needing redone on those units. 
      . Do standing/idle animation. Most all dwarven units have a simple 1 fram long standing/idle "animation" (really all of them, except for the flame team that Archmage fixed already). Do some real anim for them. 
      . Fix missing-weapon syndrome! Some units, namely the guardian and the dragon slayer will hold a weapon in some animations, but this weapon may not be present at all in others! Fix't! 
      . (Get a new armature for) the Outrider: walking animation is very poor, attack and dying should be improved. Standing animation is needed too. The unit really does need careful reanimation.
      . Look at the other two units: flame team (there's a small glitch in dying anim) and bombard (needs attack anim maybe something more).
      . Animate buildings! The Warrior's hall has been re-animated already. The foundry has boilling hot liquid metal around, only it's not actually boilling and it should be! The farm has some plants that could wave on a gentle breeze...
      . Animate the NEW units: Goat and Skyship!
   - Introduce new units:
      . The goat will be produced by the farm and can step in to the pig's position as soon as the model's animated.
      . The skyship needs a building to be produced in. I'm (kind of) working on it...
* Aglarond 0.4
   - New techtree!!! (a few important changes). More on this later...
   - Besides reordering positions: several new skills and connections.
* Aglarond 0.5
   - Press my buttons!
      . Currently, the Stop, Cancel and Hold position buttons are all the same. They should, of course, not be the same.
      . The attack buttons are usually the same for some units though e.g. the Bombard has its own (NOT theme-like!). Still, some units have different types of attacks (e.g. the dragon slayer) but the same button for them. Might have at least two kinds of attack buttons: Mellee and Ranged.
      . The goat, the skyship and the new building (for which I already have a name btw ) need their "produce ..."/"selected..." buttons.
* Aglarond 0.6
   - Sounds, sounds and more sounds! I'll be doing the voices (unless I don't ever recover my voice...   ) but I'll need someone to do the sound effects... anyone...?
   - Music: Sir Modman, your selection of tracks is great but there is one thing I whish would be better: continuum. It currently sounds like a list of musics related to Dwarves instead of a complete integrated whole... Think you can work around that? Would be great!

Well, by 0.6, what I intend to do with the dwarves will pretty much be done. So 0.6 might well become 1.0.
And once 1.0 is done, I'd go to 1.0-GAE and after that's done, I'd be done with the Dwarves too.
We'll see...

Do you want to contribute? Then please read this:
1. You must release any work you contribute to this faction under the Creative Commons Attribution Sharealike 3.0 Unported license. The sheer fact you do contribute something will be taken as your agreement upon what was just said here. 
2. The blends...
2.1. The .blend and .xcf (GIMP) files, the sources to export to the .g3d and .tga formats, that were changed or added since wciow's last Gimli release can be found here: http://www.mediafire.com/file/ydngjwynyiy/aglarond-0.1.1b_blends_and_xcfs.7z
These are up to date as of as of April 12^th.
2.2. The ones wciow provided in the old thread (Thank you! :thumbsup: ) for his Gimli release (note he did warn they were not very organised so... ). The link he provided is now dead so I recompressed the folder and reuploaded here: http://www.mediafire.com/file/niwgozxyx2h/dwarf_blends.7z

P.s.: Please see file readme.txt for info on authors/contributors, licensing and more.

[-Archmage-]

Wow, this will take a while, I'll download and setup some particles for the Warriors Hall, and send them to you for the next release!

[jda]

WARNING: I won't be updating this post anymore! Please see post #1 for updates concerning the blends and xcfs for the Dwarf faction. Thank you!

Wow, this will take a while, I'll download and setup some particles for the Warriors Hall, and send them to you for the next release!

Yes, I reckon it will take a while (actually I forgot to mention a couple things or so)...
Thanks for all the help, Arch!  

BTW, for whomever wants to contribute (only me and Archmage are currently working on this):
1. You must release any work you contribute to this faction under the Creative Commons Attribution Sharealike 3.0 Unported license. The sheer fact you do contribute something will be taken as your agreement upon what was just said.  
2. The blends...
2.1. The ones wciow provided (he did warn they were not very organised so... ): http://www.mediafire.com/?ni02mkmwm51 This link is dead, I'm waiting on wciow to tell me if it's alright for me to reupload his files...
2.2. The latest that have been worked on, ready by the time I published Aglarond 0.1.1a: http://www.mediafire.com/?h1gtcylmoet

[-Archmage-]

No Problem.
I definitely won't be doing the particles today, sorry, but maybe I can do them tomorrow, I'm behind on too many things...... :'(

[jda]

No prob, I'm sure you'll be faster than we actually need you to! 

BTW, what do you think about the changes I did to the techtree organisation and the units' XML's?
And how about the particles?

[-Archmage-]

What's the progress on dat goat?

[ultifd]

Really fun but one (at least obvious) bug 
The constructing model for the Foundry is too big... 

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[URL=http://img294.imageshack.us/i/tbig1.jpg/][IMG]http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/2031/tbig1.th.jpg[/img][/URL]  [URL=http://img233.imageshack.us/i/tbig2.jpg/][IMG]http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/9484/tbig2.th.jpg[/img][/URL]Anyways, I played a 4 vs 4 player game. For some reason, the opponents produced around 30 more units then my allies... which wasn't good for me, as you can see in the videos...

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[URL=http://img340.imageshack.us/i/fwarf.jpg/][IMG]http://img340.imageshack.us/img340/2741/fwarf.th.jpg[/img][/URL]Anyways...here are the videos of the gameplay...2nd video/part for crushing...3rd video/part for the bug.

I got pwned here.                                                                       
   
Struggle. + the bug you can see...

Overall, pretty good. Good improvements.        
Although I was looking for the goats at first.   

[jda]

Really fun but one (at least obvious) bug  
The constructing model for the Foundry is too big...  

Yeah, I noticed that too, when I got to do a game to get that screenshot into my first post. It's a strange thing actually... I had noticed that quite some time ago. I thought I fixed it but now it came back!
I've probably been pushing old and new versions of the model in and out of my working copy. Very sorry for this.
I'll upload a tested correct sized construction model for the foundry in a few moments and update this post, k?
Here is the corrected .g3d you can just copy over to units/foundry/models:
http://www.mediafire.com/file/nmmwzmknzdd/foundry_construct.g3d
(this is not perfect yet but it will fit in a 4x4 instead of the 12x12 it was before!)
For those who have not yet downloaded Dwarves Aglarond 0.1, I'll switch the link to Aglarond 0.1.1 (just the same but with this fix). And I'll do the same for the .blends too. - EDIT: DONE!

Anyways, I played a 4 vs 4 player game. For some reason, the opponents produced around 30 more units then my allies... which wasn't good for me, as you can see in the videos...

Well... THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR THE VIDEOS, THEY'RE WAY COOL (other than that one where you actually see the silly bug Well, that one actually is cool too! ).
For your opponents producing around 30 more units than your allies... I don't really believe you can blame it on the faction or the AI... Yes, that was you!!
Here's the deal: the way the AI plays is affected by the way the other players interact with them. One known case is that the more you attack an AI player the more units it will produce (and eventually make less new buildings and upgrades). This is a rather common response to being attacked...
I noticed you were actually the player who produced the less units of all the 8 players. However, you were the one, amongst your team, who got the highest number of kills, and the third higher amongst all 8 players. So... I'm assuming you were bullying your oponent players with some kind of hit-and-run attacks (not a bad tactic on say a one-on-one, I guess) and they reacted by producing more units... Noone was bullying (so much) your allies, so they didn't get to produce that many units...
I may be wrong but I'd say it was something like this that happened.  

Overall, pretty good. Good improvements.        
Although I was looking for the goats at first.    

Thanks! (whew, that's a relief, I was afraid I'd actually make the Dwarves worse!       )
Well, the goats... I'll still have to texture them for Archmage to animate them so... They might get in on the next release (0.2) assuming Archmage, as usual, gets his part done much sooner than I get mine.

BTW, Arch... erm... a few more days for the goat to get textured to you, ok?  

[-Archmage-]

Ok.

[ElimiNator]

Did you guys add a air unit yet? if not could I helkp with it. 

[-Archmage-]

No, Jda is still working on it.

[Omega]

Only just noticed this. Great work being done jda. BTW, an air unit, while tempting, is not completely necessary if given powerful enough land units. If I remember correctly, dwarfs don't usually like flying...

[ElimiNator]

I say a tech without a flying unit is not a tech at all.

Also the bombard is unfair, too much range. 

[ultifd]

Really fun but one (at least obvious) bug 
The constructing model for the Foundry is too big... 

Yeah, I noticed that too, when I got to do a game to get that screenshot into my first post. It's a strange thing actually... I had noticed that quite some time ago. I thought I fixed it but now it came back!
I've probably been pushing old and new versions of the model in and out of my working copy. Very sorry for this.
I'll upload a tested correct sized construction model for the foundry in a few moments and update this post, k?
Here is the corrected .g3d you can just copy over to units/foundry/models:
http://www.mediafire.com/file/nmmwzmknzdd/foundry_construct.g3d
(this is not perfect yet but it will fit in a 4x4 instead of the 12x12 it was before!)
For those who have not yet downloaded Dwarves Aglarond 0.1, I'll switch the link to Aglarond 0.1.1 (just the same but with this fix). And I'll do the same for the .blends too. - EDIT: DONE!

Thanks for the fix.   

VERY MUCH FOR THE VIDEOS, THEY'RE WAY COOL (other than that one where you actually see the silly bug Well, that one actually is cool too! ).

Thanks , sorry for some laggyness, an 8 player game can be a big laggy...   

For your opponents producing around 30 more units than your allies... I don't really believe you can blame it on the faction or the AI... Yes, that was you!!
Here's the deal: the way the AI plays is affected by the way the other players interact with them. One known case is that the more you attack an AI player the more units it will produce (and eventually make less new buildings and upgrades). This is a rather common response to being attacked...
I noticed you were actually the player who produced the less units of all the 8 players. However, you were the one, amongst your team, who got the highest number of kills, and the third higher amongst all 8 players. So... I'm assuming you were bullying your oponent players with some kind of hit-and-run attacks (not a bad tactic on say a one-on-one, I guess) and they reacted by producing more units... Noone was bullying (so much) your allies, so they didn't get to produce that many units...
I may be wrong but I'd say it was something like this that happened. 

Basically everything you said is correct.  Although it was actually my allys who did a hit and run tactic. (well kinda, with more units and such.)
The reason I got the l amount of kills, is that I attacked more smartly than the AI    and behind it sometimes too. Also I had a bunch of towers...but still wasn't good enough. 
And such is why there are problems with the AI. But a lot has been improved already, so maybe I should call those problems annoyances... 

Overall, pretty good. Good improvements.        
Although I was looking for the goats at first.   

Thanks! (whew, that's a relief, I was afraid I'd actually make the Dwarves worse!      )
Well, the goats... I'll still have to texture them for Archmage to animate them so... They might get in on the next release (0.2) assuming Archmage, as usual, gets his part done much sooner than I get mine.

I see, can't wait.   

Also the bombard is unfair, too much range. 

Really? I'll have to test more.

(click to show/hide)

more videos coming of gameplay!  or just videos If I suck. 
 

A flying unit would be cool, but we would have to see if it would fit.

Thanks. 

EDIT: I updated the wiki. https://docs.megaglest.org/Mod_Compilations/Techtrees/Factions_for_Glest#Dwarves
anything incorrect? also, what is a better word for "helpers" or maybe it shouldn't be... 

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[jda]

Did you guys add a air unit yet? if not could I helkp with it. 

Like -Archmage- said, I'm still working on the Skyship (see old thread for a some more info). The modelling is almost finished and I'll be moving on to texturing soon.
This is the one model for the Dwarves I don't want help with. It' mine, all mine, mine til the end! (there should be a mad-scientist like smiley ) 
Here's a current pic:

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[img]http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/9514/skyship20100320.jpg[/img]

Only just noticed this. Great work being done jda. BTW, an air unit, while tempting, is not completely necessary if given powerful enough land units. If I remember correctly, dwarfs don't usually like flying...

Thanks for the compliment.
Regarding the air unit, yes, there was some discussion about its relevance already in the old thread, even before I'd notice it myself.
My intentions for the skyship are these:
- it will be equivalent to the bombard (attacking only land too). The bombard's power btw will be lowered a bit before I balance them to each other.
- there will be scenarios/maps where a skyship is more useful than a bombard and vice versa. In most situations you'll likely want to have the same amount of skyships as of bombards in your army.
- my main motive for the dwarves to have an air unit is not so much that they use it (though naturally they will) but rather for the other factions to have an air unit to defend against!
- I think, in spite of everything, the skyship will give its pilot a comfortable safe feeling. Plus, dwarven skyship pilots are a special kind of dwarves.

I say a tech without a flying unit is not a tech at all.

Also the bombard is unfair, too much range. 

A tech may perfectly diregard the use of an air unit, specially if it is meant to be played against other factions that have no air units either. Still, that's not the case with the dwarves.

The bombard's range is currently 12, it was 22 before! Yes, 22 really was impossible! 12 still is high (and will probably be lowered once the skyship is introduced) but do you really think it is that unfair?

Thanks for the fix.   

You're welcome.

Thanks , sorry for some laggyness, an 8 player game can be a big laggy...   

Yes, well, there was some lagging here and there but the videos still look nice.

For your opponents producing around 30 more units than your allies... I don't really believe you can blame it on the faction or the AI... Yes, that was you!!
Here's the deal: the way the AI plays is affected by the way the other players interact with them. One known case is that the more you attack an AI player the more units it will produce (and eventually make less new buildings and upgrades). This is a rather common response to being attacked...
I noticed you were actually the player who produced the less units of all the 8 players. However, you were the one, amongst your team, who got the highest number of kills, and the third higher amongst all 8 players. So... I'm assuming you were bullying your oponent players with some kind of hit-and-run attacks (not a bad tactic on say a one-on-one, I guess) and they reacted by producing more units... Noone was bullying (so much) your allies, so they didn't get to produce that many units...
I may be wrong but I'd say it was something like this that happened. 

Basically everything you said is correct.  Although it was actually my allys who did a hit and run tactic. (well kinda, with more units and such.)
The reason I got the l amount of kills, is that I attacked more smartly than the AI    and behind it sometimes too. Also I had a bunch of towers...but still wasn't good enough. 
And such is why there are problems with the AI. But a lot has been improved already, so maybe I should call those problems annoyances... 

Interesting. Well... your backup-attacks (I assume you attacked behind your allies when you saw they were attacking an oponent) may have produced a greater damage to your enemies, making them feel they neeeded more units?... But I'm really just wondering now. Someone with a better insight into the CPU dwellings should give you a better answer.
Still, by your last sentence, I'd say you already identified some of the "problems with the AI". Care to tell me what those problems are? I'd really appreciate it! 

Also the bombard is unfair, too much range. 

Really? I'll have to test more.

(click to show/hide)

more videos coming of gameplay!  or just videos If I suck. 
 

(click to show/hide)

Videos are always cool!

EDIT: I updated the wiki. https://docs.megaglest.org/Mod_Compilations/Techtrees/Factions_for_Glest#Dwarves
anything incorrect? also, what is a better word for "helpers" or maybe it shouldn't be... 

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[URL=http://img197.imageshack.us/i/dffddf.jpg/][IMG]http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/5606/dffddf.jpg[/img][/URL]

Oh well... 
The Factions section in the wikia was basically redone from scratch by myself. I used a "template" (not HTML or such, just a "model" of what info to put in for each faction, techtree, ...) based off what Trappin was using for the Maps section. We had quite some good discussion about it all (some in the wikia, on the Discussion pages - someone deleted them, WHY?!; some on the wikia topic in General discussion of this very board).
Now... a few tips:
1. KISS! a.k.a. Keept It Simple, Stupyd! (not calling names to anyone, that's just what the acronym means and the philosophy is good)
This means: WHY would you add yet another field Helpers ? You already have the "Author" field which you may very easily switch to "Authors".
2. Coherence with what has been done already (please don't "mod" the wikia, a wikia is not to be "modded"!). If you look at e.g. the Elves faction, you'll see the authors are gAMeboy (the original author and only one up to Elves 0. / -Archmage- (who picked up on the faction since and made releases 0.9 and forth). This is just like the current case of the Dwarves (only with different people).
3. Coherence all across the wikia. So ok, suppose you think your take on it (adding the "Helpers" field) is a better choice than putting them "all" under "Authors". I guess you're free to do so (even more that I'm not currently working on the wikia and don't plan to do so soon either). Still, if you're gonna do it for one, do it for them all! I personally don't think it's worth the trouble.
4. Most of the mods in there are attibuted to one or two persons. In most cases, there were, for each one, at least some 2 persons more contributing... Do you really want to list them all? (try to do it e.g. for Dark Magic... you'll definitely be scr***ng yourself up!). Just list the leaders of each faction. If there is substantial work being contributed by someone else, I guess you might include them too (that's the case with most of ElimiNator and Tiger's factions). For what he's done already, I think -Archmage- should be included in the list of authors for the latest Dwarves release.

EDIT: On the "Stable" status... Hum... not sure... wciow's Gimli release was BETA! But soon enough, it became his final release! Not that it was actually finished, but he wouldn't work on it no more! Hence a beta becomes "stable". (it was pretty good already anyways).
Still, I myself find it hard to conside Algarond 0.1.1 as even Beta, I consider it rather Alpha! True, it improves on a Beta, so it should be at least Beta but... I did big changes to some buildings' sizes but not yet to their construction destruction models. E.g. you now have a size 3 Warriors Hall whose construction model is (over) size 4... Doesn't even look like Beta to me... 
Still... you can probably set the status as Beta. I wouldn't go as far as to call it "stable" though.

Thanks!

[ElimiNator]

Looks cool. need help texturing it?

[tiger]

cool tech can I help

[ElimiNator]

This is the one model for the Dwarves I don't want help with. It' mine, all mine, mine til the end! (there should be a mad-scientist like smiley ) 

Is this one ok? or this

The bombard's range is currently 12, it was 22 before! Yes, 22 really was impossible! 12 still is high (and will probably be lowered once the skyship is introduced) but do you really think it is that unfair? 

No I was talking about the 22. 

[ultifd]

Thanks , sorry for some laggyness, an 8 player game can be a big laggy...   

Yes, well, there was some lagging here and there but the videos still look nice.

Cool, thanks. 

Also the bombard is unfair, too much range. 

Really? I'll have to test more.

(click to show/hide)

more videos coming of gameplay!  or just videos If I suck. 
 

(click to show/hide)

Videos are always cool!

Yep, I know.    That's one of the reasons I upload them.

Interesting. Well... your backup-attacks (I assume you attacked behind your allies when you saw they were attacking an oponent) may have produced a greater damage to your enemies, making them feel they neeeded more units?... But I'm really just wondering now. Someone with a better insight into the CPU dwellings should give you a better answer.
Still, by your last sentence, I'd say you already identified some of the "problems with the AI". Care to tell me what those problems are? I'd really appreciate it! 

Yep, yep, I know.
The problems with the AI thing, was just what we were talking about... heh  sorry, sometimes my english is not that great, or maybe the grammar

EDIT: I updated the wiki. https://docs.megaglest.org/Mod_Compilations/Techtrees/Factions_for_Glest#Dwarves
anything incorrect? also, what is a better word for "helpers" or maybe it shouldn't be... 

Code: [Select]

[URL=http://img197.imageshack.us/i/dffddf.jpg/][IMG]http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/5606/dffddf.jpg[/img][/URL]

Oh well... 
The Factions section in the wikia was basically redone from scratch by myself. I used a "template" (not HTML or such, just a "model" of what info to put in for each faction, techtree, ...) based off what Trappin was using for the Maps section. We had quite some good discussion about it all (some in the wikia, on the Discussion pages - someone deleted them, WHY?!; some on the wikia topic in General discussion of this very board).
Now... a few tips:
1. KISS! a.k.a. Keept It Simple, Stupyd! (not calling names to anyone, that's just what the acronym means and the philosophy is good)
This means: WHY would you add yet another field Helpers ? You already have the "Author" field which you may very easily switch to "Authors".
2. Coherence with what has been done already (please don't "mod" the wikia, a wikia is not to be "modded"!). If you look at e.g. the Elves faction, you'll see the authors are gAMeboy (the original author and only one up to Elves 0. / -Archmage- (who picked up on the faction since and made releases 0.9 and forth). This is just like the current case of the Dwarves (only with different people).
3. Coherence all across the wikia. So ok, suppose you think your take on it (adding the "Helpers" field) is a better choice than putting them "all" under "Authors". I guess you're free to do so (even more that I'm not currently working on the wikia and don't plan to do so soon either). Still, if you're gonna do it for one, do it for them all! I personally don't think it's worth the trouble.
4. Most of the mods in there are attibuted to one or two persons. In most cases, there were, for each one, at least some 2 persons more contributing... Do you really want to list them all? (try to do it e.g. for Dark Magic... you'll definitely be scr***ng yourself up!). Just list the leaders of each faction. If there is substantial work being contributed by someone else, I guess you might include them too (that's the case with most of ElimiNator and Tiger's factions). For what he's done already, I think -Archmage- should be included in the list of authors for the latest Dwarves release.

Yeah, I know...archmage I think. I tried to see what it looked like, but I failed. heh. 
1. That's what I thought. I'll edit it later.
2. I see. I didn't see that. I'll edit it later. 
3. I know, I know, I'll edit it. 
4. I might, if I want to. I'll edit it, again. 
Edit, edit, edit. 

EDIT: On the "Stable" status... Hum... not sure... wciow's Gimli release was BETA! But soon enough, it became his final release! Not that it was actually finished, but he wouldn't work on it no more! Hence a beta becomes "stable". (it was pretty good already anyways).
Still, I myself find it hard to conside Algarond 0.1.1 as even Beta, I consider it rather Alpha! True, it improves on a Beta, so it should be at least Beta but... I did big changes to some buildings' sizes but not yet to their construction destruction models. E.g. you now have a size 3 Warriors Hall whose construction model is (over) size 4... Doesn't even look like Beta to me... 
Still... you can probably set the status as Beta. I wouldn't go as far as to call it "stable" though.

I see, I'll edit it.  Alpha or Beta?     

A little OT, but can we someone change the default background if the wiki, kinda like the map wiki? White doesn't look too good, unless it is the wikipedia...   

EDIT: How's this? Better? Not sure if Beta or Alpha... 
https://docs.megaglest.org/Mod_Compilations/Techtrees/Factions_for_Glest#Dwarves

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[jda]

Looks cool. need help texturing it?

No, thanks. As I said before... the Skyship is mine, mine, mine!

cool tech can I help

The roadmap (aka TODO list) is posted on the first post. Ideally, you'd start to work on what's needed for the next release, 0.2: texturing and construction/destruction models resizing/cellmap-refiting.  
But if you want to work on something that is scheduled to be released only later, you can of course (it will probably just be released... later ). 
Do NOTE the Dwarves were already pretty high quality. So... high quality is expected of you if you want your contributions to make it to the releases.

If you're up to it, look at the roadmap from 0.2 onwards and tell me what from that list you want to work on. I'll then give you more detailed instructions, ok?
Thanks.

This is the one model for the Dwarves I don't want help with. It' mine, all mine, mine til the end! (there should be a mad-scientist like smiley ) 

Is this one ok? or this

The first one would be great!   

The bombard's range is currently 12, it was 22 before! Yes, 22 really was impossible! 12 still is high (and will probably be lowered once the skyship is introduced) but do you really think it is that unfair? 

No I was talking about the 22. 

Oh, ok then. BTW, its splash also went from 2 to 1.

Also the bombard is unfair, too much range. 

Really? I'll have to test more.

ElimiNator was thinking of the old version of the bombard. See above.

Interesting. Well... your backup-attacks (I assume you attacked behind your allies when you saw they were attacking an oponent) may have produced a greater damage to your enemies, making them feel they neeeded more units?... But I'm really just wondering now. Someone with a better insight into the CPU dwellings should give you a better answer.
Still, by your last sentence, I'd say you already identified some of the "problems with the AI". Care to tell me what those problems are? I'd really appreciate it! 

Yep, yep, I know.
The problems with the AI thing, was just what we were talking about... heh  sorry, sometimes my english is not that great, or maybe the grammar

Oh, I think I see. So the problems with the AI you identified were just those ones?
If that's the case, here's my take:
- You did an 8 players game with all 8 players being dwarves.
- Given the above, most any "unbalance" that would arise in the game would actually be due to human actions, not AI's actions.
- However, even though the "trigger" might be human, the consequences (say the "bullet") might have unexpected results on the dwarves, results it would not have on tech or magic (to which the Dwarves are supposed to be balanced). This, depending on what exactly we were talking about might be considered either a peculiar trait of the Dwarf faction or rather an actual bug...

EDIT: I updated the wiki. https://docs.megaglest.org/Mod_Compilations/Techtrees/Factions_for_Glest#Dwarves
anything incorrect? also, what is a better word for "helpers" or maybe it shouldn't be... 

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Oh well... 
The Factions section in the wikia was basically redone from scratch by myself. I used a "template" (not HTML or such, just a "model" of what info to put in for each faction, techtree, ...) based off what Trappin was using for the Maps section. We had quite some good discussion about it all (some in the wikia, on the Discussion pages - someone deleted them, WHY?!; some on the wikia topic in General discussion of this very board).
Now... a few tips:
1. KISS! a.k.a. Keept It Simple, Stupyd! (not calling names to anyone, that's just what the acronym means and the philosophy is good)
This means: WHY would you add yet another field Helpers ? You already have the "Author" field which you may very easily switch to "Authors".
2. Coherence with what has been done already (please don't "mod" the wikia, a wikia is not to be "modded"!). If you look at e.g. the Elves faction, you'll see the authors are gAMeboy (the original author and only one up to Elves 0. / -Archmage- (who picked up on the faction since and made releases 0.9 and forth). This is just like the current case of the Dwarves (only with different people).
3. Coherence all across the wikia. So ok, suppose you think your take on it (adding the "Helpers" field) is a better choice than putting them "all" under "Authors". I guess you're free to do so (even more that I'm not currently working on the wikia and don't plan to do so soon either). Still, if you're gonna do it for one, do it for them all! I personally don't think it's worth the trouble.
4. Most of the mods in there are attibuted to one or two persons. In most cases, there were, for each one, at least some 2 persons more contributing... Do you really want to list them all? (try to do it e.g. for Dark Magic... you'll definitely be scr***ng yourself up!). Just list the leaders of each faction. If there is substantial work being contributed by someone else, I guess you might include them too (that's the case with most of ElimiNator and Tiger's factions). For what he's done already, I think -Archmage- should be included in the list of authors for the latest Dwarves release.

Yeah, I know...archmage I think. I tried to see what it looked like, but I failed. heh. 
1. That's what I thought. I'll edit it later.
2. I see. I didn't see that. I'll edit it later. 
3. I know, I know, I'll edit it. 
4. I might, if I want to. I'll edit it, again. 
Edit, edit, edit. 

EDIT: On the "Stable" status... Hum... not sure... wciow's Gimli release was BETA! But soon enough, it became his final release! Not that it was actually finished, but he wouldn't work on it no more! Hence a beta becomes "stable". (it was pretty good already anyways).
Still, I myself find it hard to conside Algarond 0.1.1 as even Beta, I consider it rather Alpha! True, it improves on a Beta, so it should be at least Beta but... I did big changes to some buildings' sizes but not yet to their construction destruction models. E.g. you now have a size 3 Warriors Hall whose construction model is (over) size 4... Doesn't even look like Beta to me... 
Still... you can probably set the status as Beta. I wouldn't go as far as to call it "stable" though.

I see, I'll edit it.  Alpha or Beta?     

Right, that was a bit confusing of me... Sorry. Heck, let's say Beta!

A little OT, but can we someone change the default background if the wiki, kinda like the map wiki? White doesn't look too good, unless it is the wikipedia...   

You'd probably better ask that on the Wikia topic. Or, possibly using some of wikia's own tools (I don't remember now exactly what there was available but I do recall thinking we should have a page on the wikia for "TODO on the wikia" Actually, I think there is something already only it's outdated or something...? Would have to check it out again.

EDIT: How's this? Better? Not sure if Beta or Alpha... 
https://docs.megaglest.org/Mod_Compilations/Techtrees/Factions_for_Glest#Dwarves

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"Author:" should read "Authors:"
"Release / Status:" should be followed by "Aglarond 0.1.1 / Beta"
"More info:" (as everything else now relates to Aglarond, not Gimli) would better switch the order of the forum topics: "Glest forum topic and Old release topic" (you could possibly even omit the old release topic as I link to it already from the first post of this topic but that's up to you )
Thanks for keeping the wikia pumping!

[ultifd]

EDIT: How's this? https://docs.megaglest.org/Mod_Compilations/Techtrees/Factions_for_Glest#Dwarves

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ElimiNator was thinking of the old version of the bombard. See above. 

I know that, that was from my old post. 

Oh, I think I see. So the problems with the AI you identified were just those ones?
If that's the case, here's my take:
- You did an 8 players game with all 8 players being dwarves.
- Given the above, most any "unbalance" that would arise in the game would actually be due to human actions, not AI's actions.
- However, even though the "trigger" might be human, the consequences (say the "bullet") might have unexpected results on the dwarves, results it would not have on tech or magic (to which the Dwarves are supposed to be balanced). This, depending on what exactly we were talking about might be considered either a peculiar trait of the Dwarf faction or rather an actual bug...    

Yeah, that's why I need to test/play some more...   

Right, that was a bit confusing of me... Sorry. Heck, let's say Beta! 

Ok, I'll edit it later then. 

You'd probably better ask that on the Wikia topic. Or, possibly using some of wikia's own tools (I don't remember now exactly what there was available but I do recall thinking we should have a page on the wikia for "TODO on the wikia" Wink Actually, I think there is something already only it's outdated or something...? Would have to check it out again. Wink

Yeah, I'll see... But then I might have to DP...oh well... 

"Author:" should read "Authors:"
"Release / Status:" should be followed by "Aglarond 0.1.1 / Beta"
"More info:" (as everything else now relates to Aglarond, not Gimli) would better switch the order of the forum topics: "Glest forum topic and Old release topic" (you could possibly even omit the old release topic as I link to it already from the first post of this topic but that's up to you Wink )
Thanks for keeping the wikia pumping! 

Yeah  , I'll edit it later... 
No problem , my pleasure, or more of one of the only contributions I have to the Glest community. 
Besides my videos. 

[jda]

Yeah, that's why I need to test/play some more...   

Go ahead!

No problem , my pleasure, or more of one of the only contributions I have to the Glest community. 
Besides my videos. 

Oh, serious editing of the Wikia is a very much needed and valuable contribution!

(click to show/hide)

much more than some mods, if you ask me.

 
The videos too!

[ultifd]

Yeah, that's why I need to test/play some more...   

Go ahead!

No problem , my pleasure, or more of one of the only contributions I have to the Glest community. 
Besides my videos. 

Oh, serious editing of the Wikia is a very much needed and valuable contribution!

(click to show/hide)

much more than some mods, if you ask me.

 
The videos too!

Yep, I will.   

Yeah, I know. 
---------
How's this? https://docs.megaglest.org/Mod_Compilations/Techtrees/Factions_for_Glest#Dwarves

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[img]http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/1936/ss1k.jpg[/img]

[jda]

Yep, I will.

Cool! 

How's this? https://docs.megaglest.org/Mod_Compilations/Techtrees/Factions_for_Glest#Dwarves

Fine!  

[ultifd]

How's this? https://docs.megaglest.org/Mod_Compilations/Techtrees/Factions_for_Glest#Dwarves

Fine!  

Sweet. 

When is Aglarond 0.2 going to be released/come out/uploaded? Any approximate date...?
Thanks, and good luck.