Author Topic: Allow for disbanding units (Read 5244 times)

tomreyn · « **on:** 24 June 2010, 11:54:56 »

Sometimes you will end up with a situation where a unit is no longer of use. This can happen when you make a worker place buildings around itself or other units so that those other units can no longer move. In such situations it would be nice if it was possible to disband (kill/remove) that unit, so it stops consuming resources and slowing down the game while it cannot be used.

Edit: typo

ultifd · « **Reply #1 on:** 24 June 2010, 18:33:57 »

Hmm, this could be unwanted to...in some situations...but, I could see why this would be helpful...
For now, I think GAE has this feature. Or somewhat of it...

Omega · « **Reply #2 on:** 26 June 2010, 05:27:23 »

Quote from: ultifd on 24 June 2010, 18:33:57

Hmm, this could be unwanted to...in some situations...but, I could see why this would be helpful...
For now, I think GAE has this feature. Or somewhat of it...

No, it does not.

ultifd · « **Reply #3 on:** 26 June 2010, 06:34:55 »

Quote from: Omega on 26 June 2010, 05:27:23

Quote from: ultifd on 24 June 2010, 18:33:57
Hmm, this could be unwanted to...in some situations...but, I could see why this would be helpful...
For now, I think GAE has this feature. Or somewhat of it...
No, it does not.

Yeah, I know know...I was thinking of auto-repair.
So...

Quote

Or somewhat of it...

Kinda... or not.

claymore · « **Reply #4 on:** 27 June 2010, 10:11:07 »

I don't really think this would be useful. When this does happen (and it doesn't happen very often), it's usually pretty easy to have other units attack and kill the trapped ones.

Also, how would this feature be triggered? A hotkey? You could hit it accidentally, or while searching for another key.

ultifd · « **Reply #5 on:** 27 June 2010, 17:19:59 »

Well...it could be option able...so in the...options?

Anyways, maybe good or not nice idea, but for now we just have to make/and test MG till it is stable before titi's vacation...

tomreyn · « **Reply #6 on:** 27 June 2010, 19:07:00 »

Claymore told me on IRC that he suggests not to introduce this feature if it only requires a single key stroke to trigger a currently selected unit to be disbanded. However, he seems to be ok with a key combo triggering it.

I've been in situations where I had units trapped and, at the same time, I was lacking the ability to create new units (for lack of energy/food) but needed to do so urgently. Unfortunately I had no units with ranged weapons in the area and having to move some there just to kill a trapped unit feels quite silly. Of course, you can try and just ignore that trapped unit but I like it when all units serve some purpose.

Little Helper · « **Reply #7 on:** 9 July 2010, 19:19:01 »

This feature could be very helpful me because I have units that are not in need because you know...I got better and stronger units but I kill them my self to free up space O_O

wyvern · « **Reply #8 on:** 9 July 2010, 22:12:15 »

If you kill them yourself you get kills for it so that an up point

tomreyn · « **Reply #9 on:** 10 July 2010, 18:21:24 »

On the other hand you could argue that one should not be awarded points for killing ones' own units.

wyvern · « **Reply #10 on:** 11 July 2010, 19:47:12 »

Or your troops should be demoralized, for example the Russian army of ww2

titi · « **Reply #11 on:** 13 August 2010, 10:23:04 »

I don't see much benefit from this feature

ultifd · « **Reply #12 on:** 13 August 2010, 18:21:49 »

Hmm...weird, I never really got into a situation like what tomreyn said.

tomreyn · « **Reply #13 on:** 15 August 2010, 12:35:48 »

I had 3 Acolytes (workers) trapped in a recent game where we were playing the Dark Magic faction. So it does happen.

Omega · « **Reply #14 on:** 15 August 2010, 20:13:01 »

Really though, its not worth implimenting. You shouldn't build things THAT CLOSE TOGETHER! Never ever build a building within two spaces of another. Even the CPU is smarter than that... You'll just get your produced units trapped. In all honesty, this isn't needed because if your units ever get trapped in, that was a bad player mistake, and you may as well destroy one of the buildings and replace it. And even when you do need to kill one of your own units, there's no real disadvantage to simply killing the unit with one of your own units.

wyvern · « **Reply #15 on:** 15 August 2010, 21:05:37 »

The AI does it a lot though I've often seen up to 4 catapults stranded because of this.

modman · « **Reply #16 on:** 16 August 2010, 02:51:16 »

Quote from: Wyvern on 15 August 2010, 21:05:37

The AI does it a lot though I've often seen up to 4 catapults stranded because of this.

Good point. The AI really should be able to disband (delete; same thing) units. They always stack up around the gold and slow the game down. Then they have no progress.

titi · « **Reply #17 on:** 16 August 2010, 11:05:17 »

I don't think the ai really plays too bad ;-) . Its true that there are trapped units quite often, but hey, the cpu is good enough with these trapped units or can you kill a mega-cpu? Bigger problems is that the ultra cpu sometimes gives more than 50 produce commands to one building!
And even this doesn't really matter! I solved this produce command queuing for the mega cpu and you all know what happened .....
A perfect fighting CPU would be the nighmare for all players!

So I think that human players already know what to do and the ai has to live with this handicap.

modman · « **Reply #18 on:** 16 August 2010, 15:00:09 »

Quote from: titi on 16 August 2010, 11:05:17

A perfect fighting CPU would be the nighmare for all players! So I think that human players already know what to do and the ai has to live with this handicap.

Well, I think the goal is to remove the AI's cheating ability and replace it with actual intelligence.

orion · « **Reply #19 on:** 19 August 2010, 01:09:34 »

Destroying units isn't a bad idea, in my opinion; I wouldn't say that it's a completely useless feature. Situations may occur where you want to destroy certain structures to make room for other units. Like many of you said, the AI could use this feature in many ways to fix some jamming (units clogging together). Also, you can take into account that the default location of some units is inconvenient (ex. when you start the game and the Defense Tower is in an awkward/useless position), so adding a unit/structure deletion feature could add some versatility. Like tomreyn said, there is sometimes a situation where your units are trapped.....

If this feature were to be implemented, however, I wouldn't suggest that the user be able to regain the full amount of resources used to create the destroyed structure/UNIT. Personally, I'd suggest that the user be allowed to recover 50% or 25% of the resources used (or maybe even none at all). By doing this, we'd be adding in a "recycle" sort of function in the game that could also be used in a strategic way. For example, units can be "recycled" in order to regain a partial amount of the resources used which can then be used to create other units that you maybe wouldn't have had the gold to build unless you "recycled".

Just an idea. I think this would be a great feature to implement.

Mark · « **Reply #20 on:** 21 August 2010, 00:00:16 »

Quote from: Sir modman on 16 August 2010, 15:00:09

Quote from: titi on 16 August 2010, 11:05:17
A perfect fighting CPU would be the nighmare for all players! So I think that human players already know what to do and the ai has to live with this handicap.
Well, I think the goal is to remove the AI's cheating ability and replace it with actual intelligence.

Yes. Only a bad AI system requires cheating. In glest, there are not many programmable strategies (outside lua AIs), so I can see why cheating was done.

tomreyn · « **Reply #21 on:** 26 August 2010, 22:25:22 »

Quote from: Aaris'lia Orion on 19 August 2010, 01:09:34

If this feature were to be implemented, however, I wouldn't suggest that the user be able to regain the full amount of resources used to create the destroyed structure/UNIT.

Actually, when I originally suggested this, I had 'no refunds, ever' in mind. And I think that's really the way it should be. Otherwise it would be a matter of time until people start to delete units which were badly wounded in a fight and won't recover quickly. And it's also not how life works.

Seeing that peoples' opinion on the matter whether or not there could be a disband units feature at all is somewhat diverse, IF this gets implemented (which I still hope), it should be implemented as an option, set on the game server.

ZaggyDad · « **Reply #22 on:** 28 August 2010, 21:12:43 »

Why not just have it always enabled and just have a confirmation dialog come up if you try to delete any of your units? I find that having one of my units kill the other to get rid of a useless/unwanted unit is a total waste of time, since it takes so long to kill them.

~Zaggy1024

claymore · « **Reply #23 on:** 1 September 2010, 11:24:32 »

A dialog would be ugly. Better would be a key combination (shift+delete perhaps).

Zoythrus · « **Reply #24 on:** 1 September 2010, 13:54:21 »

Quote from: tomreyn on 26 August 2010, 22:25:22

Quote from: Aaris'lia Orion on 19 August 2010, 01:09:34
If this feature were to be implemented, however, I wouldn't suggest that the user be able to regain the full amount of resources used to create the destroyed structure/UNIT.

Actually, when I originally suggested this, I had 'no refunds, ever' in mind. And I think that's really the way it should be. Otherwise it would be a matter of time until people start to delete units which were badly wounded in a fight and won't recover quickly. And it's also not how life works.

maybe, the more damage it has taken, the less resources you get back.

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Author Topic: Allow for disbanding units (Read 5244 times)

claymore

Little Helper

wyvern

wyvern

wyvern

modman

modman

orion

Mark

ZaggyDad

claymore

Zoythrus