Multiplayer Enhancement Idea

[orion]

After not playing this game for a long time, the one thing that I notice that has improved the most is multiplayer. It's fantastic that there is now a master server for games, but I have a suggestion. Why not create an in game lobby? Let me explain.

For years, one of my favorite games to play has been Scorched3D. The part of that game that I admire the most is their multiplayer system. In their setup, players wanting to have an online game can see all of the active games from the master server (even if the game is in progress). For example, if Titi, Softcoder, and Omega were each hosting games, all 3 of their names would appear on the master server (even if the game was in progress). Next to each of their names would be a status that describes the state of the game (ex. in-game, choosing players, etc) Players could then join the game (despite if the game is in progress) and watch the game as a spectator until the game ends and a new one starts.

I may be wrong, but when a multiplayer game ends in Glest, it seems like the host disappears (or unregisters) from the master server and players will have to connect again in order to play again. Is it possible for the players to remain connected to the host until: 1. either the host decides to quit, or 2. the player decides to quit. In other words, is it possible to remain a host even when the game ends?

The reason I am suggesting this is to make Glest Multiplayer seem more lively. I believe that more people would play online if they saw hosts on the server more, even if the game is in progress. Giving them the ability to watch games will probably lead to them sticking around for the next game on that host.

I apologize if: 1. I'm not making any sense  , 2. this has already been discussed, or 3. this is not the direction that the developers want to move into. I tried to explain my idea the best that I could, but perhaps you could download Scorched3D (google it) and try out the multiplayer system for yourselves. Even though that game is dying, this game is going in the other direction and I think that a multiplayer lobby would help with online activity.

[softcoder]

I think all the ideas sound very good and I will consider these carefully.

[orion]

ok. good to know that I made sense xD

[tomreyn]

I agree, and you explained it very well, too.

[Omega]

Hmm, I have played scorched3D, and I admit, you have a good idea.

It could also be nice if we could chat too, similar to how an IRC works. After all, we need a way to organize the game, know how we should set it up, etc but at the moment, that requires a 3rd party program...

[ElimiNator]

What is wrong with the chat we have now?

And great ideas Aaris'lia Orion. 

[ultifd]

Not in game chat, lobby chat Omega means...(or whatever it's called.

It could also be nice if we could chat too, similar to how an IRC works. After all, we need a way to organize the game, know how we should set it up, etc but at the moment, that requires a 3rd party program...

We'd probably use IRC anyways ...
just not for now I guess.
Nice ideas Orion. If implemented, it would probably be awesome.

[orion]

If everything is implemented correctly, the average player may not need to use the IRC anymore (only the devs and testers). If the average player is allowed to join active servers and spectate as well as chat with other players in game (like in scorched3d), then there won't be much need to log into the irc to organize a game anymore (unless it's a tournament or some other special event).
main
Furthermore, in scorched there are several public main hosts that are always online and any player can join them. If this feature were to be added into Glest (official hosts that are always online), MANY people would play online; I'm sure players would rather fight against real people than computers.

[tomreyn]

If everything is implemented correctly, the average player may not need to use the IRC anymore (only the devs and testers). If the average player is allowed to join active servers and spectate as well as chat with other players in game (like in scorched3d), then there won't be much need to log into the irc to organize a game anymore (unless it's a tournament or some other special event).

Observer mode
 

Furthermore, in scorched there are several public main hosts that are always online and any player can join them. If this feature were to be added into Glest (official hosts that are always online), MANY people would play online; I'm sure players would rather fight against real people than computers.

Headless game server

[softcoder]

Observer mode is in SVN to be tested and decided whether or not it stays. If it stays it will need discussion around how it should work fully.

Current the observer mode is implemented as a special 'built-in' faction that a player selects indicating they only want to watch the game. Observers are not considered in game over calculations and can be used for single or multi-player games (currently taking a slot).

I don't fully like it like this but it is a start. Remember that even observers must stay in synch for network games and they add to the possible lag since they must render graphics and receive / send network data to control the units showed on their screen.

Feedback is welcome.

[ultifd]

Man, you are fast.  

Remember that even observers must stay in synch for network games and they add to the possible lag since they must render graphics and receive / send network data to control the units showed on their screen.

So it is true... I think that would be a big problem later when random people observe other's game. Unless you need permission to join. (not sure if there is.)

[softcoder]

We are quickly approaching a new release. Observer mode now seems quite stable. A few notes about this feature:

- The server must allow Observers using a new menu option (single player can toggle it on to watch the AI play itself)
- Observers belong to their OWN team (current a special team #9 which non observers cannot pick)
- Observers do not influence the state of the game over conditions.
- Observers have full view of the world (even when fog of war is enabled for others)
- Observers can chat.

[ultifd]

The problem with observers being able to chat is that they might help others...so there might be cheating. IE 3 vs 3 game with 2 observers, observers tell hints or give away locations...etc.

[ElimiNator]

The problem with observers being able to chat is that they might help others...so there might be cheating. IE 3 vs 3 game with 2 observers, observers tell hints or give away locations...etc.

Yah but when they talk every one can see and they will know that your cheating.

[softcoder]

Also the Server may allow or disallow observers, so if you allow an observer and they create trouble, don't let them be an observer next time. Problem solved. I don't think adding a kick feature should be required.

[ultifd]

...Anyways, we'll see then... I just think that this might be a problem.

Problem solved. I don't think adding a kick feature should be required.

Yeah, I guess, only if a lot of cheating happens in the future.

The problem with observers being able to chat is that they might help others...so there might be cheating. IE 3 vs 3 game with 2 observers, observers tell hints or give away locations...etc.

Yah but when they talk every one can see and they will know that your cheating.

So the problem has already happened...

[Zoythrus]

i second this, but i think that it should be more like the SpringRTS lobby (especially the TASClient). that was so easy to learn and allowed you to see it all happening at once. the best part is, the IRC was integrated into it, so you could chat and find battles.

[softcoder]

Ok, with the current masterserver and using the svn version of MG, published games will now STAY in the server list in the Internet menu. Old clients and new clients will see the games being played by any NEW client because now we send status updates to the master server. New clients will have their 'join game' button replaced with a label saying 'Game Full' when that game has no more open slots. When a game has started the game title will also have an *IN PROGRESS* text added to the end of the game title. In this way we will at least know that there are games being played and people could wait around in the lobby till others are ready to play.

[orion]

w00t. I've been having computer problems for the last month and haven't been able to play but I will definately test this out when I get the chance since I have a new laptop. Thanks for making this, softcoder.