Author Topic: Units: Aggro and Control  (Read 1806 times)

ChupaReaper

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Units: Aggro and Control
« on: 12 October 2010, 10:53:59 »
I'm not sure if GAE or Glest does anything with aggro but if the AI is going to be improved and stuff then maybe it's a good time to request this.
Basically this could be added either under the unit's parameters or under skills, probably best under skills or maybe commands even.
Aggro draws the attenion of AI units (also player units that are auto-attacking), this is good for 'tanking' units and also powerful but weak units that have high aggro as their drawback. Units could have an emanation or effect or something that forces other units to attack it if they can (or use other skills that they may have against their will).
This offers tanking and crowd control which are good in RTSs as well as RPGs.

Gabbe

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Re: Units: Aggro and Control
« Reply #1 on: 13 October 2010, 18:52:29 »
What does Aggro mean?

nvm..

an MMORPG when you "piss off" an NPC(non-player character) and it enters a combat state with your character. Most often used when multiple NPC's are attacking you because you got too close or you attacked them.
"I just aggro'd 15 level 80's! I need a heal!"

ChupaReaper

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Re: Units: Aggro and Control
« Reply #2 on: 13 October 2010, 20:10:03 »
What does Aggro mean?

nvm..

an MMORPG when you "piss off" an NPC(non-player character) and it enters a combat state with your character. Most often used when multiple NPC's are attacking you because you got too close or you attacked them.
"I just aggro'd 15 level 80's! I need a heal!"

That's basically it but it is more important than that, consider having two players and a bunch of NPCs, one player has a weak defence and low health but really strong attack, then the second player has a very tough defence and high health but barely any attack, without using aggro the weak player would get killed of quick and the tough player would last longer but soon die being unable to kill off the enemies due to his low attack.

If the tough player has more aggro and the enemies think he is more threatening, then they will attack him. This means the weaker player with higher attack can deal greater damage whilst the tough player takes the damage for him.

You can also throw a healing based unit into the mix. This unit is weak but can heal other units a great amount, so can keep the tough player alive in a long battle.

Edit: The aggro system could help implement stealth units too, maybe using a negative aggro value or something?
« Last Edit: 14 October 2010, 10:17:28 by ChupaReaper »

Zoythrus

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Re: Units: Aggro and Control
« Reply #3 on: 18 October 2010, 18:48:28 »
this is similar to this idea of priorities. just say you have an anti-air guy who has a weak anti-surface attack for ground...just in case; and this guy starts fighting ground units then an air unit appears. priorities would mean that he would automatically stop attacking the ground units and would fire upon the air dude. maybe something like this could be used for aggro (or vice-versa)?

Omega

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Re: Units: Aggro and Control
« Reply #4 on: 19 October 2010, 00:36:19 »
That's also a bit of an AI thing really. GAE *does* have a start to an "AI tips" tags, but they are woefully incomplete and Daniel never implemented them beyond the point of being in the XML... A priority list would be very handy though, abet, being a complicated AI "thing".

Edit: The aggro system could help implement stealth units too, maybe using a negative aggro value or something?
Wouldn't negative aggro be cowardice? ie: a worker who runs when foes appear (currently, they do, as long as they aren't doing something else. Ideally, they would run on sight if they are just sitting around, but only run when being attacked if they are doing a command (obviously, a worker harvesting is useless if he's being attacked, since odds are, he'll be killed before he even finishes harvesting).
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Re: Units: Aggro and Control
« Reply #5 on: 19 October 2010, 01:19:19 »
Quote from: Omega
Quote from: ChupaReaper on October 13, 2010, 17:14:51
Edit: The aggro system could help implement stealth units too, maybe using a negative aggro value or something?
Wouldn't negative aggro be cowardice? ie: a worker who runs when foes appear (currently, they do, as long as they aren't doing something else. Ideally, they would run on sight if they are just sitting around, but only run when being attacked if they are doing a command (obviously, a worker harvesting is useless if he's being attacked, since odds are, he'll be killed before he even finishes harvesting).

No negative aggro would repel the enemy probably. :P
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Re: Units: Aggro and Control
« Reply #6 on: 19 October 2010, 05:53:39 »
I should point out that there is an attack-skill preferences system already, but it is woefully incomplete...
https://docs.megaglest.org/GAE/Command_XML#Common_Attack_Command_Elements

Not entirely relevant to the OP, but some more flags for those will allow 'priorities' to be implemented.
« Last Edit: 18 June 2016, 13:46:47 by filux »
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ChupaReaper

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Re: Units: Aggro and Control
« Reply #7 on: 19 October 2010, 07:49:38 »
They look interesting, can do a lot with stuff like that, still an overall threat count for units would be useful, negative threat but stop units auto attacking the target (or from being able to at all?) and a fear system would be fun to see, say have a unit cast a powerful spell that sends everything around it running in fear using effects to set fear.

Psychedelic_hands

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Re: Units: Aggro and Control
« Reply #8 on: 19 October 2010, 09:48:58 »
this is similar to this idea of priorities. just say you have an anti-air guy who has a weak anti-surface attack for ground...just in case; and this guy starts fighting ground units then an air unit appears. priorities would mean that he would automatically stop attacking the ground units and would fire upon the air dude. maybe something like this could be used for aggro (or vice-versa)?
I'm not too sure I'd like this.... It would be good for the A.I but it would get rid of a lot of required  battle management..... Which I like doing.... it just destroys basic tactics...

ChupaReaper

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Re: Units: Aggro and Control
« Reply #9 on: 19 October 2010, 10:40:23 »
this is similar to this idea of priorities. just say you have an anti-air guy who has a weak anti-surface attack for ground...just in case; and this guy starts fighting ground units then an air unit appears. priorities would mean that he would automatically stop attacking the ground units and would fire upon the air dude. maybe something like this could be used for aggro (or vice-versa)?
I'm not too sure I'd like this.... It would be good for the A.I but it would get rid of a lot of required  battle management..... Which I like doing.... it just destroys basic tactics...

Not entirely, it adds to tactics but takes the stupid click this and click that out, realistically, people are gonna want to shoot the great big dragon rather than some random small guy in the background by default, you can then tell your units otherwise as usual, but you can have units which lure other units in and forces them to attack it rather than other units or you can terrify them and have them run away, all of these add much more to the game tactics without destroying the original game and it all benefits the AI which needs a lot of boosts right now.

Psychedelic_hands

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Re: Units: Aggro and Control
« Reply #10 on: 19 October 2010, 10:42:48 »
this is similar to this idea of priorities. just say you have an anti-air guy who has a weak anti-surface attack for ground...just in case; and this guy starts fighting ground units then an air unit appears. priorities would mean that he would automatically stop attacking the ground units and would fire upon the air dude. maybe something like this could be used for aggro (or vice-versa)?
I'm not too sure I'd like this.... It would be good for the A.I but it would get rid of a lot of required  battle management..... Which I like doing.... it just destroys basic tactics...

Not entirely, it adds to tactics but takes the stupid click this and click that out, realistically, people are gonna want to shoot the great big dragon rather than some random small guy in the background by default, you can then tell your units otherwise as usual, but you can have units which lure other units in and forces them to attack it rather than other units or you can terrify them and have them run away, all of these add much more to the game tactics without destroying the original game and it all benefits the AI which needs a lot of boosts right now.

I was more talking about unit priorities than your idea, I like your idea :)

ChupaReaper

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Re: Units: Aggro and Control
« Reply #11 on: 19 October 2010, 11:58:50 »
this is similar to this idea of priorities. just say you have an anti-air guy who has a weak anti-surface attack for ground...just in case; and this guy starts fighting ground units then an air unit appears. priorities would mean that he would automatically stop attacking the ground units and would fire upon the air dude. maybe something like this could be used for aggro (or vice-versa)?
I'm not too sure I'd like this.... It would be good for the A.I but it would get rid of a lot of required  battle management..... Which I like doing.... it just destroys basic tactics...

Not entirely, it adds to tactics but takes the stupid click this and click that out, realistically, people are gonna want to shoot the great big dragon rather than some random small guy in the background by default, you can then tell your units otherwise as usual, but you can have units which lure other units in and forces them to attack it rather than other units or you can terrify them and have them run away, all of these add much more to the game tactics without destroying the original game and it all benefits the AI which needs a lot of boosts right now.

I was more talking about unit priorities than your idea, I like your idea :)

Ahh ok cool :P

 

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