alternative ways to show teamcolor

[titi]

this is a continuation of the discussion started in the "monster/alien Factions" topic

To repeat it the discussed ways of showing teamcolor:

- as teamcolor in models the way we all know it
- with particles ( the way it is possible now )
- with automatically added particle systems showing the team ( typically holding only one or two big particles showing for example a circle or an aura )
- somthing above the units

[titi]

reply to tomreyns idea given in other thread:
I personally don't like the idea of showing something above the heads of the units. All games I know look crappy with these bars over the head.
There is no discussion that this is useful while playing, but it looks so BAD!
I would really prefer a decent particlesystem around the unit ( showing only 1 or 2 particles! )

All in all I really like the fact that the modder is forced to think about teamcolor! He is responsible to show it to the player in a good way and he already has all possibilities to do so. ( healthbars over heads is something different! ) Also I always say to all new modders "think about teamcolor" obviously many modders simply ignore this fact and we see factions without any teamcolor. For this I would like to introduce something new ( maybe extra bad looking to remind him to do it )

[Ishmaru]

Blitzkreg II mod for C&C Generals used highlighted circles to show team color:

(click to show/hide)

The thing is that you want to fix the issue of modders not putting team color, so will these be applied globally to all mods or just to units/factions without teamcolor?

Any way lets not force all modders to use these alternative team color themes.  But its good to have some alternative choices.

[John.d.h]

Do we actually have that many modders who are too lazy to add team color to their units?

[Coldfusionstorm]

No, team colour is easy to add, takes 5 seconds in "the gimp" with a allready finished texture. now GOOD looking teamcolour is harder, but really, we don't need a alternative. as allways if you do implement more options make them optional.

[Omega]

The commonly requested feature since time immortal was a hotkey that would toggle outlining of all units with their team color. It would have three settings, off (no outline), regular (each unit is outlined with its team color), and stance (each unit is outlined at green if it's your unit, blue if it's an ally, and red if it's an enemy), and could be toggled between each with a button, say, tab.

[wyvern]

Do we actually have that many modders who are too lazy to add team color to their units?

Its not necessarily laziness but the fact that team color doesn't always fit in, for example, where's team color supposed to go on a WW2 tank without making the proper texture look awful

[Ishmaru]

Do we actually have that many modders who are too lazy to add team color to their units?

Its not necessarily laziness but the fact that team color doesn't always fit in, for example, where's team color supposed to go on a WW2 tank without making the proper texture look awful

What would u suggest to do to signify team in this case?

[Omega]

Do we actually have that many modders who are too lazy to add team color to their units?

Its not necessarily laziness but the fact that team color doesn't always fit in, for example, where's team color supposed to go on a WW2 tank without making the proper texture look awful

I don't think every unit would need team color, such as this example, but if a unit can have team color, it should. Though, a tank perhaps could have some type of logo or insignia in team color?

[wyvern]

I think the idea of having the team color in the HP circle around the unit is good, and possibly a small color flag at the base of/above a unit

[MuwuM]

Well I'm in favor with some kind of combination of what was mentioned before. Here are 2 additional ways that I'd prefer (maybe make both possible and let modder decide ...):

• replacing current hp/ep - circle with an teamcolor - circle and adding hp/ep - bars on top of the unit.
  AND / OR
  
• And a square in Teamcolor above the unit. It should use an alphamap or something similar. So you could include faction logo, too.

[Omega]

I'm not so sure about replacing the HP bars, nor blocking units with stuff hovering over their heads. They just don't look good, especially if the circle or hover-over-head-thingy is always on, and if not always on, having to select a unit to find out if it's yours is impractical. I stand by the toggleable outlining in teamcolor. I recall in another RTS (AoE2?) that if a unit was obstructed, the obstructed part would be outlined in teamcolor to allow you to see the unit, and think that would work well here, except instead of outlining obstructed units, outline the entire unit when the hotkey is pressed.

The major advantage of this is that players can choose for themselves what to see. If the mod they are playing doesn't have teamcolor, then they can toggle this on if they are having trouble telling what unit is what. Some players may not want such an obtrusive method as previously listed if the units have ample teamcolor, which brings me to a final point that we should not be sourcing out teamcolor on models. If the model can have teamcolor on it, it should, and something like an outline should be a backup for the mods that are lacking teamcolor. And I assure you it's very easy to place teamcolor on units, just look at Magitech!

[titi]

can someone post an example picture how this outlining would look like?

[Mr War]

Never against adding functionality to help game play and missing options, but to voice an opinion, I think current approach is completely adequate.

[Omega]

Exactly as the name implies, a simple outline outside the model.



The smooth feathering here is optional, may be more practical for a simpler 1 px solid outline.

[will]

This is routinely done by drawing the units slightly scaled up and in solid colour (or fancy glow) and blending this with the background (without updating depth) before drawing the units.

[Pizza90]

My 2 cents: I think how we show team colour now it's okay, i would not add too many frills to show the team colour, a coloured piece on the unit is enough, in a tank for example i think that there could be a part in the cannon coloured as the team, it would be easy ^^ I would concentrate more on the contrast between the unit texture and the team colour to make the team colour more recognizable (for example i think that indians have too much colours and their team colour is mixed with the one of their clothes)

[Coldfusionstorm]

I _DO_ NOT_ like outlining!.

that said, just keep it optional.

[ElimiNator]

Exactly as the name implies, a simple outline outside the model.



The smooth feathering here is optional, may be more practical for a simpler 1 px solid outline.

This, I say NO! I like it how it is. If you eventually do add some sort of team collor thing make it optional.

[Omega]

For those of you who just looked at the picture without reading any of the thread, you seem to misunderstand one thing about the outline: it is *never* on unless you tell it to. Everything is exactly the same as it is normally until you press a hotkey (eg: tab), in which case the outlining is enabled until you press that hotkey again. It's not meant to be played with it on, that'd be ugly. It's simply meant for players who cannot distinguish if a unit is theirs (ie: on a mod that doesn't have or lacks good teamcolor), in which case, they can hit the hotkey, see it, then hit it again.

What difference does it make to you? Well, if you don't like it, you will never see it, unless you accidentally hit the button in game. It would *always* default to off, and wouldn't have an INI setting for it either, since it's a per-situation feature. I myself wouldn't use it much, as I am perfectly happy with how team color works, but if you have a group of units in a forest and can't see them, or there's a massive battle going on with 3 or 4 different teams, then that might be (very) helpful.

[wyvern]

The lack of team color can also bring advantages at times, since you can confuse a human opponent as to which unit is their's and which one isn't

[ElimiNator]

So long as its optional I am fine with it.

[John.d.h]

Hey, I have a solution: How about modders just fix their damn textures?

[Omega]

Hey, I have a solution: How about modders just fix their damn textures?

John, your words of wisdom are like honey for this game. +1

[ultifd]

It's going to be like what Ishmaru said, with particles.  Now stop criticizing...
(Well particles and textures.) But wouldn't particles be better?